Karl`s PC Help Forums

Devil worshipers
TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 21:59

I did a Google search on the words, "Devil Worshippers" and came up with 709,000 results.

Thats real BAD!!

So many Godless people wasting their lives talking and believing and worshipping the Devil and for what exactly?? I don't see any point in it. I mean, they can't be aitheists. They know God exists, but choose to look the other way and worship something which wants to cause harm and misery to all.

I guess it comes down to a person with a serious mental problem or someone who doesn't have a happy life and wants to die or summin' confused2

I looked and read this: http://www.theisticsatanism.com/geifodd/diabolatry.html

God knows why 'Ozzy' is pictured at the top confused2

He's married to such a lovely God loving woman - good old Sharon Osbourne eh' ;)

Anyway, the story is interesting. Especially this part,
------------------------------------------------------------
Did you know that the Devil is not mentioned anywhere in the Old Testament? Sure, there's a fellow called "Satan" in the book of Job, but he's far from being the Prince of Darkness and arch-Enemy of Jehovah. Instead, the "Satan" in that story is just a heavenly prosecutor who tests Job's faith, at Jehovah's command. No, the idea of the Devil doesn't show up in the Bible until the New Testament.

But did you know that there is not a SINGLE verse in the entire New Testament which refers to the Devil as an angel? It says that He "masquerades as an angel of light" (2 Corinthians 11:14), but that's quite different from actually BEING an angel of light. It also indicates, in passages like Matthew 25:41, that He has angels in His service. But nowhere in the entire book does it actually say that HE is an angel!
------------------------------------------------------------

Who cares anyway??

I would rather believe and think of God and happiness and even reincarnation/afterlife. Not burning in Hell or preaching about the Anti-Christ. :(:(

Any thoughts on this?


janet - 5-3-2008 at 22:00

Have you done any research on Satanism, etc.?

Read any of the information?

A lot of the stuff out there is written by people who have not bothered....


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:02

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Have you done any research on Satanism, etc.?

Read any of the information?

A lot of the stuff out there is written by people who have not bothered....


No I haven't..neither would I wish to.

It's like reading a book about 'Rape' and preaching how good it is to rape someone.

I'd rather not go there, or here either. But thousands and thousands do. Can you understand what is going through their sick minds Janet?


janet - 5-3-2008 at 22:05

Since I've read a great deal about it - and have some knowledge about it - most of those involved are not sick, not at least in the way you mean.

I don't agree with a lot of what, for instance, LaVey wrote, but some of it makes a great deal of sense.

You condemn something on the basis of third hand information, rather than looking to see what is actually going on.

That's your choice, but it's not mine.


SRD - 5-3-2008 at 22:09

I can't see the difference, those that need to worship will always find a suitable subject to worship.


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:12

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Since I've read a great deal about it - and have some knowledge about it - most of those involved are not sick, not at least in the way you mean.

I don't agree with a lot of what, for instance, LaVey wrote, but some of it makes a great deal of sense.

You condemn something on the basis of third hand information, rather than looking to see what is actually going on.

That's your choice, but it's not mine.


I am sure that if you read about the subject at length, then you can make a better judgement about the subject at hand - whether 'Devil worship' or 'Murder'

If I hear a story on the news - that a child has been sacrificed to the Devil, I feel sick and angry. These stories are true and some Devil Worshippers wish to take a pro-active approach to Devil worship and kill in the name of the Devil.

I have seen all 'The Omen' films and most people would assume that the Anti Christ is about 'evil' and 'harming people'. It is not about happiness and goodness and kindness - is it?

Also, many don't care about any (positive side) if there is any?


giron - 5-3-2008 at 22:13

Some folk worship false Gods, others worship 'Forum Gods '. lips_sealed


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:15

Quote:
Originally posted by SRD
I can't see the difference, those that need to worship will always find a suitable subject to worship.


How is Devil worship a suitable subject confused2confused2

'Unsuitable' sounds better.

I don't see children in the UK/USA or AUSTRALIA being pushed in that direction, do you?


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:16

Quote:
Originally posted by giron
Some folk worship false Gods, others worship 'Forum Gods '. lips_sealed


There's no Forum Gods on here giron

*unless you know something...I don't* shocked_yellow


SRD - 5-3-2008 at 22:23

As you are unaware of the details I suggest you do some research to get an idea about what satanic worship involves. Lethal human sacrifice is rarely (if at all) a feature in Western satanic worship. You've been reading too much Dennis Wheatley.

From the little I know on the subject; Aleister Crowley(a charlatan)'s injunction that 'Do as thou wilt shall be the whole of the law' ought to be qualified with 'as long as no other objects'.

As I understand it satanists tend to think that this world is satan's realm and that the enjoyment of earthly pleasures is most suitable for his realm. This is a gross simplification by the way.


janet - 5-3-2008 at 22:28

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Since I've read a great deal about it - and have some knowledge about it - most of those involved are not sick, not at least in the way you mean.

I don't agree with a lot of what, for instance, LaVey wrote, but some of it makes a great deal of sense.

You condemn something on the basis of third hand information, rather than looking to see what is actually going on.

That's your choice, but it's not mine.


I am sure that if you read about the subject at length, then you can make a better judgement about the subject at hand - whether 'Devil worship' or 'Murder'

If I hear a story on the news - that a child has been sacrificed to the Devil, I feel sick and angry. These stories are true and some Devil Worshippers wish to take a pro-active approach to Devil worship and kill in the name of the Devil.

I have seen all 'The Omen' films and most people would assume that the Anti Christ is about 'evil' and 'harming people'. It is not about happiness and goodness and kindness - is it?

Also, many don't care about any (positive side) if there is any?


You're aware that those who investigate such things for the government are unsure that satanic abuse actually exists?

SAR

I really do suggest you do some solid research and not base your ideas on popular movies...


janet - 5-3-2008 at 22:29

Quote:
Originally posted by SRD
As you are unaware of the details I suggest you do some research to get an idea about what satanic worship involves. Lethal human sacrifice is rarely (if at all) a feature in Western satanic worship. You've been reading too much Dennis Wheatley.

From the little I know on the subject; Aleister Crowley(a charlatan)'s injunction that 'Do as thou wilt shall be the whole of the law' ought to be qualified with 'as long as no other objects'.


And Crowley was no Satanist. He was a Thelemite, if one wishes to categorise things... or a member of the OTO or AA or a number of other organisations.

AND - love and do what you will is much, much older than uncle Al... and is pretty much Christian in origin.


giron - 5-3-2008 at 22:31

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


*unless you know something...I don't* shocked_yellow


As it happens, I do, but I've been sworn to secrecy. ;)


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:36

Quote:
Originally posted by SRD
As you are unaware of the details I suggest you do some research to get an idea about what satanic worship involves.


I don't fancy trawling through heaps of literature on the subject. I go boggle-eyed reading books or pages on the internet anyroads :( Give me a film or a programme on TV and I may give it a try? There's probably something on the subject on Youtube. Might have a look some-time, or maybe I'll stick on a Music video instead YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! that sounds more fun :D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Quote:
Lethal human sacrifice is rarely (if at all) a feature in Western satanic worship.


I agree it won't be too commonplace. But I have heard it a few times on the news'n'stuff ya' know :)

Quote:
You've been reading too much Dennis Wheatley.


Who's he (when he's at home) confused2

Quote:
From the little I know on the subject; Aleister Crowley(a charlatan)'s injunction that 'Do as thou wilt shall be the whole of the law' ought to be qualified with 'as long as no other objects'.


I'm sure it's well boring and morbid. Even if you did give it a bang... you could certainly learn a lot more from the good book :) I'd rather believe in God and follow that way of life and relate to others who are nice and stuff, rather than being evil and stuff which is to do with the Anti-Christ. :(

Quote:
As I understand it satanists tend to think that this world is satan's realm and that the enjoyment of earthly pleasures is most suitable for his realm. This is a gross simplification by the way.


In English please confused2 (only joking lol SRD) :D

If you follow (Satan), you follow it all. You can hardly pick and choose the best parts, can you?

Well you can....I suppose confused2confused2 I mean, the Devil breaks rules...right Kill1


janet - 5-3-2008 at 22:39

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words

If you follow (Satan), you follow it all. You can hardly pick and choose the best parts, can you?

Well you can....I suppose confused2confused2 I mean, the Devil breaks rules...right Kill1


I'm intrigued. You say you know next to nothing about this, but still say what those involved can and can not do?


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:46

Quote:
Originally posted by janet


You're aware that those who investigate such things for the government are unsure that satanic abuse actually exists?

SAR

I really do suggest you do some solid research and not base your ideas on popular movies...


Read most of that Janet...slightly interesting, I guessconfused2

I saw this,
-------------------------------
Approximately 300 years ago, almost two dozen innocent people in Salem, MA, were charged with witchcraft and executed by hanging; one was pressed to death. Between 1980 and 1995, a North-American wide panic involved beliefs in Satanic Ritual Abuse. Nobody knows when the next panic will occur. Our best defense against future panics is awareness of past panics.
-------------------------------

MA stands for Massachusetts right confused2

Well, 300 years ago they killed two dozen people or were apparently innocent confused2 But today, if two dozen people killed in the name of the Devil, they would be killed also or have a life sentance huh.

Witchcraft is like Magic. Just a trick - to fool us that it is real.


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:47

Quote:
Originally posted by giron
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


*unless you know something...I don't* shocked_yellow


As it happens, I do, but I've been sworn to secrecy. ;)


Okay giron...I'll take your word on that ;)

But I'll keep guessing :D:D


Redwolf5150 - 5-3-2008 at 22:48

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words

If you follow (Satan), you follow it all. You can hardly pick and choose the best parts, can you?

Well you can....I suppose confused2confused2 I mean, the Devil breaks rules...right Kill1


I'm intrigued. You say you know next to nothing about this, but still say what those involved can and can not do?


I was going trot out one of my favorite quotes about those who form opinions based on misinformation.

But I don't want Dot smiting me again.

So I won't.

kewl_glasses


SRD - 5-3-2008 at 22:48

janet: I did say my research into this subject was slight, and I was generalising for the OP's benefit.


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:49

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words

If you follow (Satan), you follow it all. You can hardly pick and choose the best parts, can you?

Well you can....I suppose confused2confused2 I mean, the Devil breaks rules...right Kill1


I'm intrigued. You say you know next to nothing about this, but still say what those involved can and can not do?


Thats why I said what I said in my last sentance, they can break rules 'Right' :D:D


Redwolf5150 - 5-3-2008 at 22:50

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Witchcraft is like Magic. Just a trick - to fool us that it is real.


Now you're just showing your ignorance.

kewl_glasses


giron - 5-3-2008 at 22:54

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150

But I don't want Dot smiting me again.



I wish to protest!

Why hasn't Dot offered to smite me?

This is blatant discrimination, if ever I saw it, why the devil do people do that? shocked_yellow


janet - 5-3-2008 at 22:55

Quote:
Originally posted by SRD
janet: I did say my research into this subject was slight, and I was generalising for the OP's benefit.


Nodding - I know. Sorry, I didn't mean to come across as correcting you, more adding to the thread. Apologies.


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:57

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Witchcraft is like Magic. Just a trick - to fool us that it is real.


Now you're just showing your ignorance.

kewl_glasses


Witchcraft is about spells'n'stuff. The witches or devil worshippers read from a big thick book and perform evil acts on their victims.

i saw Sabrina the teenage witch do it on that tv show, lol :D

When any magician performs magic, it is just a trick. You know David Copperfield and his amazing acts, don't you :)


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 22:59

Quote:
Originally posted by giron
Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150

But I don't want Dot smiting me again.



I wish to protest!

Why hasn't Dot offered to smite me?

This is blatant discrimination, if ever I saw it, why the devil do people do that? shocked_yellow


Hey giron, you mention the Devil in the right thread though :P


janet - 5-3-2008 at 22:59

You know, then, why Crowley insisted on spelling it magick?

Do you have any idea about any of this or are you just adding a bit more hate to the world for the sake of it?


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 23:04

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
You know, then, why Crowley insisted on spelling it magick?

Do you have any idea about any of this or are you just adding a bit more hate to the world for the sake of it?


Is that post in reply to me or SRD?

I certainly don't claim to know more about the subject than you do. I can see that by what you have mentioned in this thread :)

However, i do agree that those who worship the devil instead of God are pretty sad people - to be honest. Why worship the Anti-Christ??

In regards to adding more hate to the world, well I'd assume very well that devil worshippers do that very well. Something that doesn't interest me - thats for sure.

Like I wrote already, the good book is much better :D


janet - 5-3-2008 at 23:11

But you're posting things that could easily lead people to hate others - based on popular movies and books, rather than solid research.

Why did you start this thread, if you a. don't know much about the subject and b. have no desire to know more?

If you'd even read the link you posted at the beginning, you'd see that the equation between Satan and the AntiChrist is not one that a lot of people accept -including the website you linked to in the first place.


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 23:30

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
But you're posting things that could easily lead people to hate others - based on popular movies and books, rather than solid research.


It's just a debate on the subject at hand. The links within the thread certainly highlight the point in which you address, so thats got that sorted.

I do know that many people who worship the devil can do some terrible things, that is fact and documented. For every defence, there is a prosecution. You have certainly highlighted the defence for Devil worshippers, I have done the opposite.

Quote:
Why did you start this thread, if you a. don't know much about the subject and b. have no desire to know more?


I hardly need an explanation for that.

I said that I'm not interested in reading books'n'stuff on the subject, as I have no desire to. Not too interested in reading books anyway. I'd rather see a docu on tv or summin' (nothing wrong in that) is there.

Quote:
If you'd even read the link you posted at the beginning, you'd see that the equation between Satan and the AntiChrist is not one that a lot of people accept -including the website you linked to in the first place.


Thats just one website I picked at hand. I'm hardly likely to draw any conclusion from that one website that Devil Worship is exactly what it says in some article on some website am I?

Many devil-worshipers don't even think about that. They know that God exists and so does the devil and they choose to worship the devil. I say that is silly to do and rather sad. I expect others to fight against that, that is what makes a good debate.

Better than trying to work out why someone brought up the subject, thoughconfused2


janet - 5-3-2008 at 23:32

Ok, I'm at a loss.

You've no desire to read about it, and say that you're unlikely to form your opinions on a website. But you're happy to quote popular movies as a source?

You go on about what "many devil worshippers" think - but on what basis? The Omen?

I wasn't trying to work out why you brought it up - I was asking.


TooCute4Words - 5-3-2008 at 23:37

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Ok, I'm at a loss.

You've no desire to read about it, and say that you're unlikely to form your opinions on a website. But you're happy to quote popular movies as a source?

You go on about what "many devil worshippers" think - but on what basis? The Omen?

I wasn't trying to work out why you brought it up - I was asking.


I can't really add anymore than I have already really?

I am just opening up a discussion on a subject. If others know more about it than I do and I am wrong, then I shall stand corrected.

I'm okay with it all waveysmiley


janet - 5-3-2008 at 23:52

I thought you *weren't* opening a discussion on the subject, since you've said you don't want to look anything up, read anything on the subject, etc.?

I'm not an expert by any means but I have had to do some research around this for various reasons - and The Omen, etc. are simply not good resources. Wheatley had a pretty good idea of what he was talking about in some areas, but he was a novelist, feeding a market that wanted and paid for sensationalist literature.

I'd really suggest having a look at the religious tolerance page I posted, rather than going off things that are clearly fictional.


DeWitch - 6-3-2008 at 00:53

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Witchcraft is like Magic. Just a trick - to fool us that it is real.


Now you're just showing your ignorance.

kewl_glasses


Redwolf5150 - 6-3-2008 at 02:41

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by giron
Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150

But I don't want Dot smiting me again.



I wish to protest!

Why hasn't Dot offered to smite me?

This is blatant discrimination, if ever I saw it, why the devil do people do that? shocked_yellow


Hey giron, you mention the Devil in the right thread though :P


*sigh*

The young and the clueless.

He did it on purpose ya chowderhead! Get with the KF sarcasm or ye shall be left in the dust!

:D


Redwolf5150 - 6-3-2008 at 02:46

And I suppose you'll be whacking on those who play D&D next.

You just wait until Badgergirl sees this thread, you'll be ribbiting out of the other side of your mouth.

roffle


DeWitch - 6-3-2008 at 03:43

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
And I suppose you'll be whacking on those who play D&D next.

You just wait until Badgergirl sees this thread, you'll be ribbiting out of the other side of your mouth.

roffle

heee heeee heeeeeee


John_Little - 6-3-2008 at 09:25

Ok, I know this is daft, but there is a serious point to this - albeit possibly (probably) in an inadvertent way.

Intensionally or not, TCFW has a point about asking what drives so called "Satanists" to seek to associate with the concept.

So called "Satanism" is a relatively new idea - modern in fact. It is the antithesis of worshiping "God". So those that choose to call themselves "satanists" are merely adopting a position opposite that of a section of society.

So, why would they do that? Why would they feel the need to rebel in this way? Why would they bother to invent rituals and everything else that goes with it just so they can be extremely different to other people?

Why?


SRD - 6-3-2008 at 09:31

I don' think they are trying to be very different, they feel a need for belief and ritual in the same way that 'good' god worshippers do, they don't like the rules of the existing religions so they invent their own, or at least take on board rules that suit what they want in their religion.


janet - 6-3-2008 at 09:34

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
Ok, I know this is daft, but there is a serious point to this - albeit possibly (probably) in an inadvertent way.

Intensionally or not, TCFW has a point about asking what drives so called "Satanists" to seek to associate with the concept.

So called "Satanism" is a relatively new idea - modern in fact. It is the antithesis of worshiping "God". So those that choose to call themselves "satanists" are merely adopting a position opposite that of a section of society.


I think we need to differentiate here between the rebellious teen who dons a hoodie that says Hail Satan!! on it - and those who are, for example, members of the Temple of Set. (The Church of Satan as a legal entity no longer exists, though you can still find all kinds of people telling you they are members....).

The first,yes, that's an act of rebellion, an "in your face" kind of action.

The second is generally (considering the process of actually joining) a much more considered process.

(And I'm not sure I'd agree that it's a modern concept, either).

The Temple of Set, which grew out of the Church of Satan, is a fairly different sort of entity.
Quote:



So, why would they do that? Why would they feel the need to rebel in this way? Why would they bother to invent rituals and everything else that goes with it just so they can be extremely different to other people?

Why?


A good number of the rituals are far older than one might imagine - there's a record of Cellini being present at the conjuring of a minor demon, for instance - and such rituals can be traced a *long* way back.

The reasons? The usual ones: satisfaction, fulfilment, power, etc.

The Temple of Set was led at the outset (and I think he may be back in charge now... ) by a man of formidable intelligence and a not insignificant area of employment...


John_Little - 6-3-2008 at 09:47

Janet, please dont confuse paganism with satanism. Pagans do not worship satan. Though satanists themselves confuse paganism and popular views of witchcraft (again, a fictitious derivative of paganism) and pick and mix bits from old real religions and populuar myth as portrayed in Old Hammer Horror films and books by Crowley and the like. Crowley was an absolute nutter by the way.

Pagans, on the other hand, are as whimsical but no more harmful than Christians. They believe in mother nature but are mostly harmless.


John_Little - 6-3-2008 at 09:51

Of course, there are also a number of older religions - like the old Egyptian and Roman ones that are also resourced by these people.

They are not, though, alive and well and living in surbiton.


dr john - 6-3-2008 at 10:30

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


I saw this,
-------------------------------
Approximately 300 years ago, almost two dozen innocent people in Salem, MA, were charged with witchcraft and executed by hanging; one was pressed to death. Between 1980 and 1995, a North-American wide panic involved beliefs in Satanic Ritual Abuse. Nobody knows when the next panic will occur. Our best defense against future panics is awareness of past panics.
-------------------------------


The Salem event did not involve devil worshippers killing people, it involved christians panicking and assuming some innocent people were evil witches and then killing them.

The key word in the bit you have quoted is PANIC. Believers in a god panicked and ran around like headless chickens (sic) screaming Devil worshipper, human sacrifice, witches! Burn the witch! Save our children! They must be doing bad things to the children!

It was just panic, the events they feared / imagined did not actually occur.

You really got to try doing a bit more research. (And remember, the movies are make-believe, stories with actors pretending...)

We have had a couple of "witch hunts" in this country a decade or so ago as well. Just panic in both cases. Involving a doctor with a rather vivid imagination.


John_Little - 6-3-2008 at 10:37

I saw that documentary.

It was absolutely (there's that word again) shocking that so called educated people could believe that stuff and bring so much suffering to so many people in that way.

Just goes to show though, Doctor John, that the date may change but people dont always move with the times.


SRD - 6-3-2008 at 10:45

Comes of not doing your research.


John_Little - 6-3-2008 at 10:48

Dont mention the research. I mentioned it once but didn't get away with it.


LSemmens - 6-3-2008 at 13:33

Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.


SRD - 6-3-2008 at 13:50

confused2


John_Little - 6-3-2008 at 15:11

I sort of recognise that quote. Dont leave us in suspense, Leigh.


John_Little - 6-3-2008 at 15:13

S'ok Leigh. got it:-


<< Philippians 4:8 >>
New American Standard Bible (©1995)
Finally, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, dwell on these things.

King James Bible
Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.


TRUE Amiable Anything Beautiful Brethren Brothers Cherish Deemed Dwell Excellence Excellent Finally Gracious Grave Holy Honest Honorable Honour Lovable Lovely Noble Praise Praiseworthy Pure Report Repute Respect Rest Righteous Upright Value Virtue Whatever Whatsoever Wins Worthiness Worthy


janet - 6-3-2008 at 16:52

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
Janet, please dont confuse paganism with satanism. Pagans do not worship satan.


Where did I do that?

Quote:


Though satanists themselves confuse paganism and popular views of witchcraft (again, a fictitious derivative of paganism)

Gardner, Sanders and a host of thousands would disagree with you there.

And I would, as well - Murray's thesis is long gone.
Quote:


and pick and mix bits from old real religions and populuar myth as portrayed in Old Hammer Horror films and books by Crowley and the like. Crowley was an absolute nutter by the way.


Crowley was a brilliant mind, a nut case, an incredible mountaineer, much less of a good poet than he thought he was, a fascinating writer and a remarkably bad tenor....



Quote:


Pagans, on the other hand, are as whimsical but no more harmful than Christians. They believe in mother nature but are mostly harmless.


Um, no?

There is no way on earth to say, "Pagans believe" any more than there is any other group that large.

Asatru believe one set of things, Hellenic reconstructionists another, reconstructionist Druids a third thing... there's not even agreement among those who self define as Wiccan, considering how anthithetical the beliefs and practices of say, Dianic Wiccans and Gardenerians are.


janet - 6-3-2008 at 16:53

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
Of course, there are also a number of older religions - like the old Egyptian and Roman ones that are also resourced by these people.

They are not, though, alive and well and living in surbiton.


I actually think you might be surprised.

Have a look at Neos Alexandria for example.

Reconstructionist groups are alive and well.


Badgergirl - 6-3-2008 at 19:39

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
And I suppose you'll be whacking on those who play D&D next.

You just wait until Badgergirl sees this thread, you'll be ribbiting out of the other side of your mouth.

roffle


Seen it....started to ribbet myself!
Now reading the rest of the thread.....I think I'll start to hop if it carried on the way it SEEMS to be going.


Badgergirl - 6-3-2008 at 19:47

*sigh*

Just....

*sigh*

TCFW, I like you, but please, please do a bit of research!

I've got a good friend who professes to be a Satanist. (His first name makes this more Ironic), and he's one of the sweetest kindest Men I know.

I'm a Pagan, I practice forms of Witchcraft, I don't like Wicca, I have Norse Gods (Which isn't the same as worshiping!), I am one of the New Age Fruitloops who does this sort of thing.

One thing I'm NOT is a "White Witch", and this oft leads to accusations of Satanism.

Can you see where categoring people BEFORE you know individuals can get you? Tangled up in Jargon!kewl_glasses


scholar - 6-3-2008 at 20:06

I've listened to radio interviews with a Luciferian who is also a remote viewer. (He used to work with a famous remote viewer who is a Fundamentalist, and they parted company, in part, because of their different approaches to life.) I noticed he never used any of the other terms that Christians use for the same entity.


Redwolf5150 - 6-3-2008 at 20:37

This thread is a good example of how prejudices get started.

Lack of accurate information = incorrect assumptions.

And you know what they say about the word assume, right?

kewl_glasses


janet - 6-3-2008 at 21:02

Well, I've tried to point to reasonable sources.

The religious tolerance site is a useful one.

The sources for Crowley are many - Perdurabo is a readable place to start.

The Pagan Federation is a reasonable place to start on the general subject (I'm not thrilled with the accuracy of some of their fact sheets, but the issues I have are minor...). I'd not call Pagan Dawn a journal, at least it is not one in the academic sense. The Pomegrante, however, is such. As is the Journal for the academic study of magic (for whom I have a paper outstanding, which I've never found time to write up. My bad...).

There *are* reasonable, reputable sources out there.

Those do *not* include sensationalist literature (Denis Wheatley, Stephen King....) or sensationalist media (The Blair Witch Project, The Omen (parts one to whatever))...

If we're going to insist on freedom to practice our own religious views, and request respect for them, it's only equitable that we find out about the views and practices of others *before* we wander around scare mongering about them.


TooCute4Words - 6-3-2008 at 21:31

Not too bothered about all the negativity towards myself within this thread - in relation to my knowledge on satanism

My reason for starting this thread, is because IMO I would find it sad for someone to spend their lives worshipping the Devil, rather than God.

Ask (Joe public) in your local shopping centre whether they think Devil-worshipping is a good thing?

1) Should people do it?
2) Is it the right thing to teach your children?
3) Should it be a prefered choice - rather than God and Jesus?
4) Would you be suspicious of a person who worships the Devil/Satan?
5) Would you like to be part of that?
666) Are you an expert or a near expert on the subject?

HAVE A GUESS WHAT MOST WOULD SAY??

How about a percentage aye? I'd say about 1% May be able to agree with number 666 BUT, 99% would agree with me and say it is wrong.

I also DON'T need to be well versed in a subject to start a thread.

1) I gave MY opinion
2) You gave yours
3) Some MAY agree
4) Some MAY not agree
5) Redwolf will come out with the usual (nasty dig) rolls_eyes (nothing new there lol) 'Still thinkin' about the Copyright thread huh?? confused2
6) Thanks 'Badgergirl' and 'John_little' BTW.
7) I also shall stand corrected, if I learn something I didn't know already.
8) In regards to Devil-Worship, I choose to dislike the idea of someone or more being part of it.
9) One absolute FACT!!! F.A.O.: (Janet) Some people who worship the Devil, DO..Kill in the name of the Devil and DO..make human and animal sacrifices, in the name of the Devil. That is a FACT!! Many Devilworshippers will get a BAD reputation - due to fanatics. I guess it's like the National Front. There are some lovely Racist/Homophobes in that party, who can be really pleasant indeed. BUT!! There are also extremists who go around with Balaclava's and Baseball bats and will beat the living Sh*t out of a person. But just like Devilworshippers, I guess they get a bad name due to the minority who opt to be that way.

I am open-minded on many subjects. But as I am more interested in happiness and faith and God and Jesus, etc.. I choose to NOT think of Devil-worshipping in my life.

To be honest....Anyone looking at this thread could certainly see the difference between Good and Evil from the posts (worded) within.

There you go....My response :D


janet - 6-3-2008 at 21:46

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Not too bothered about all the negativity towards myself within this thread - in relation to my knowledge on satanism


Do you mean satanism or devil worship or luciferianism? They're not the same things.
Quote:


My reason for starting this thread, is because IMO I would find it sad for someone to spend their lives worshipping the Devil, rather than God.

Ask (Joe public) in your local shopping centre whether they think Devil-worshipping is a good thing?


Why? Has anyone, at all, in this thread, suggested that it might be?

No.

We have, however, suggested that before someone posts about how wrong something is, they actually get their facts straight.

This isn't negative toward you, it's a simple point.
Quote:


1) Should people do it?
2) Is it the right thing to teach your children?
3) Should it be a prefered choice - rather than God and Jesus?
4) Would you be suspicious of a person who worships the Devil/Satan?
5) Would you like to be part of that?
666) Are you an expert or a near expert on the subject?


First off, since when is right and wrong determined by supermarket polls?

Secondly - why only the choice between Christianity and satanism? Why leave out the second largest religious group in the world?

Thirdly - I have to ask - who designed that questionnaire? ;)

I never get to take these, by the way. I've yet to find a public-opinion poll that allows those who are actually employed in research or journalism to take it. We're on the list of barred professions. I wonder why that is?

(Redwolf, is it the same in the States?)
Quote:


HAVE A GUESS WHAT MOST WOULD SAY??

How about a percentage aye? I'd say about 1% May be able to agree with number 666 BUT, 99% would agree with me and say it is wrong.



You're still saying it's wrong when you don't know much about it?

And the number you want, by the way, is 661, not 666. Unless you're talking Iron Maiden rather than theology.
Quote:

I also DON'T need to be well versed in a subject to start a thread.


No one said you did.

If you start a thread saying, "I don't know much about X...", in fact, it makes sense.

If you start a thread saying, "This is wrong and I know because I saw a popular film", you're not likely to get as many takers.
Quote:


1) I gave MY opinion
2) You gave yours
3) Some MAY agree
4) Some MAY not agree
5) Redwolf will come out with the usual (nasty dig) rolls_eyes (nothing new there lol) 'Still thinkin' about the Copyright thread huh?? confused2
6) Thanks 'Badgergirl' and 'John_little' BTW.
7) I also shall stand corrected, if I learn something I didn't know already.



You might, if you actually follow some of the links posted, do a bit of research and reading....

Quote:

8) In regards to Devil-Worship, I choose to dislike the idea of someone or more being part of it.
9) One absolute FACT!!! F.A.O.: (Janet) Some people who worship the Devil, DO..Kill in the name of the Devil and DO..make human and animal sacrifices, in the name of the Devil. That is a FACT!!

I do wish you'd back that up with reputable sources. That doesn't include sensationalist media, btw.

I suspect you are confounding a number of things, to be honest: muti is not the same thing as devil worship, for instance. Nor is santeria the same, by a long shot...

And animal sacrifices have a long and venerable history in the Bible...
Quote:



Many Devilworshippers will get a BAD reputation - due to fanatics. I guess it's like the National Front. There are some lovely Racist/Homophobes in that party, who can be really pleasant indeed. BUT!! There are also extremists who go around with Balaclava's and Baseball bats and will beat the living Sh*t out of a person. But just like Devilworshippers, I guess they get a bad name due to the minority who opt to be that way.

I am open-minded on many subjects. But as I am more interested in happiness and faith and God and Jesus, etc.. I choose to NOT think of Devil-worshipping in my life.


Fine - I haven't seen anyone here advocating that you take it up.

In fact, there are a good number of resources I've not cited because I'm not comfortable doing so.

You choose not to think about it, which is your choice. I've had to research into it a bit for various reasons.

The difference is, I've gone away and formed opinions based on research...

Quote:



To be honest....Anyone looking at this thread could certainly see the difference between Good and Evil from the posts (worded) within.

There you go....My response :D


So - agreeing with you is Good and disagreeing is Evil?

Interesting take.

Not unusual, I grant you but I think unsupportable by the Christian ethics you want to claim....

(No, that is NOT calling you unChristian. It's pointing out that the statement is a cry for sympathy that didn't work).


TooCute4Words - 6-3-2008 at 22:54

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

Not too bothered about all the negativity towards myself within this thread - in relation to my knowledge on satanism

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Do you mean satanism or devil worship or luciferianism? They're not the same things.


The thread title said, 'Devil Worship'. As 'Satanism' was brought up, I just used that word. If it is different, then I stand corrected. The word 'Luciferianism' I have never heard of. I guess if you mentioned 'Lucifer', 'Satan' or the 'Devil to joe public, they would all say (names for the Devil). Would you agree that is a fair assessment?

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

My reason for starting this thread, is because IMO I would find it sad for someone to spend their lives worshipping the Devil, rather than God.

Ask (Joe public) in your local shopping centre whether they think Devil-worshipping is a good thing?

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Why? Has anyone, at all, in this thread, suggested that it might be?

No.

We have, however, suggested that before someone posts about how wrong something is, they actually get their facts straight.

This isn't negative toward you, it's a simple point.


I said in that quote, (In my opinion, I would find it sad for someone to worship the devil, rather than God. That means Janet, it is my own opinion - (which I am entitled to). It is not about getting facts straight. It is about MY OPINION. Which I am entitled to say.

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

1) Should people do it?
2) Is it the right thing to teach your children?
3) Should it be a prefered choice - rather than God and Jesus?
4) Would you be suspicious of a person who worships the Devil/Satan?
5) Would you like to be part of that?
666) Are you an expert or a near expert on the subject?

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

First off, since when is right and wrong determined by supermarket polls?


I used that as an example of (Joe public). I just mentioned a supermarket - thats all. It basically will give a good idea of what the majority think. Whether they are well versed is neither-here-nor-there. I am a member of Joe public on this forum who gives my opinion on the subject.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Secondly - why only the choice between Christianity and satanism? Why leave out the second largest religious group in the world?


I also left out 'Sun worshippers' too and about a thousand or so others....whats the point exactly?? If I missed the second largest religious group, it hardly matters - as we are debating about (Devil Worshippers) are we not confused2

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Thirdly - I have to ask - who designed that questionnaire? ;)


Does it matter?

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I never get to take these, by the way. I've yet to find a public-opinion poll that allows those who are actually employed in research or journalism to take it. We're on the list of barred professions. I wonder why that is?


I don't know...sorry!! I assumed that if your a journalist doing your shopping, they won't ask your profession before asking for your opinion

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

(Redwolf, is it the same in the States?)


I'm sure he will reply without having a dig at myself ;)

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

HAVE A GUESS WHAT MOST WOULD SAY??

How about a percentage aye? I'd say about 1% May be able to agree with number 666 BUT, 99% would agree with me and say it is wrong.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

You're still saying it's wrong when you don't know much about it?


I certainly didn't say anything like that in that above quote Janet. What I did say, that logic dictates that if a poll was done, that the percentages agreeing with Satanism, Luciferism or Devil Worship would be low. Logic dictates that. Many people prefer to worship God. Are you surprised Janet??

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

And the number you want, by the way, is 661, not 666. Unless you're talking Iron Maiden rather than theology.


I have never heard 661 as being the number for the Devil/Satan or Lucifer in my life. I would actually state a FACT, that if you asked a hundred people whether the number for the Devil is either '666' or '661', over 90% would say '666'. Is that a fair assessment Janet? confused2

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

I also DON'T need to be well versed in a subject to start a thread.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

No one said you did.

If you start a thread saying, "I don't know much about X...", in fact, it makes sense.

If you start a thread saying, "This is wrong and I know because I saw a popular film", you're not likely to get as many takers.


:bon) It is really knitpicking and I won't bite lips_sealed

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

1) I gave MY opinion
2) You gave yours
3) Some MAY agree
4) Some MAY not agree
5) Redwolf will come out with the usual (nasty dig) rolls_eyes (nothing new there lol) 'Still thinkin' about the Copyright thread huh?? confused2
6) Thanks 'Badgergirl' and 'John_little' BTW.
7) I also shall stand corrected, if I learn something I didn't know already.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

You might, if you actually follow some of the links posted, do a bit of research and reading....


I've already answered that question within this thread. I choose to NOT read about Devil Worship. I brushed through the links and that is as far as I chose to go. If there is a problem with that, then I appologise for you not liking that.

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

8) In regards to Devil-Worship, I choose to dislike the idea of someone or more being part of it.
9) One absolute FACT!!! F.A.O.: (Janet) Some people who worship the Devil, DO..Kill in the name of the Devil and DO..make human and animal sacrifices, in the name of the Devil. That is a FACT!!

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I do wish you'd back that up with reputable sources. That doesn't include sensationalist media, btw.


I have recently heard about it on the televised news actually. Perhaps they were lying and made it all up as an April Fool joke confused2 But I doubt that and most would agree with me, soz.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I suspect you are confounding a number of things, to be honest: muti is not the same thing as devil worship, for instance. Nor is santeria the same, by a long shot...


You keep bringing up these variants of Devil Worship, but to be honest, my thread just said (Devil worshippers) and my opinion on the subject. It is extremely nice of you to expand on the subject and mention other names and I am sure you have certainly spoke very wise on the expansion.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

And animal sacrifices have a long and venerable history in the Bible...


I know they do. I am also not saying that everything is perfect in the world of God either. That was never my agenda

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

Many Devilworshippers will get a BAD reputation - due to fanatics. I guess it's like the National Front. There are some lovely Racist/Homophobes in that party, who can be really pleasant indeed. BUT!! There are also extremists who go around with Balaclava's and Baseball bats and will beat the living Sh*t out of a person. But just like Devilworshippers, I guess they get a bad name due to the minority who opt to be that way.

I am open-minded on many subjects. But as I am more interested in happiness and faith and God and Jesus, etc.. I choose to NOT think of Devil-worshipping in my life.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Fine - I haven't seen anyone here advocating that you take it up.


Thats true Janet :)

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

In fact, there are a good number of resources I've not cited because I'm not comfortable doing so.


That is your luxury to not do so, as it is my luxy to have an opinion and ignore anyone who chooses to make a mountain out of a molehill and knit-pick out of entertainment value.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

You choose not to think about it, which is your choice. I've had to research into it a bit for various reasons.


I am glad you agree. Why did you feel compelled to research the subject a bit? It appears that you are certainly more well-versed than most? unless it's a wickapedia job?

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

The difference is, I've gone away and formed opinions based on research...


Fair enough!! I was more interested in a pleasant nights posting on this forum and starting a few harmless threads, but then a mountain out of a molehill gets made and I sometimes wonder about hidden agenda's confused2

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

To be honest....Anyone looking at this thread could certainly see the difference between Good and Evil from the posts (worded) within.

There you go....My response :D

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

So - agreeing with you is Good and disagreeing is Evil?

Interesting take.

Not unusual, I grant you but I think unsupportable by the Christian ethics you want to claim....


Not at all Janet. You misunderstood my comment. I was actually talking about the comments and the (wording) within certain posts towards my good self and some other stuff as well. It sounded like a touch of forum bullying or perhaps ageism or even oneupmanship.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

(No, that is NOT calling you unChristian. It's pointing out that the statement is a cry for sympathy that didn't work).


Sympathy.......huhrolls_eyes


marymary100 - 6-3-2008 at 23:03

Who is bullying you TC4W?


TooCute4Words - 6-3-2008 at 23:06

Quote:
Originally posted by marymary100
Who is bullying you TC4W?


I'll u2u You :)


marymary100 - 6-3-2008 at 23:07

That's what it's there for. :)


giron - 6-3-2008 at 23:16

Could I just point out that it wasn't me! waggyfinger

If TC4W tells you differently, I'll ruddy kill 'im! lips_sealed


janet - 6-3-2008 at 23:19

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Do you mean satanism or devil worship or luciferianism? They're not the same things.


The thread title said, 'Devil Worship'. As 'Satanism' was brought up, I just used that word. If it is different, then I stand corrected. The word 'Luciferianism' I have never heard of.
? It's been mentioned in this thread...
And not by me.

Quote:

I guess if you mentioned 'Lucifer', 'Satan' or the 'Devil to joe public, they would all say (names for the Devil). Would you agree that is a fair assessment?


I have no idea - I don't take my theology from popular opinion, nor do I see popular opinion as an arbiter of same...

Quote:


Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Why? Has anyone, at all, in this thread, suggested that it might be?

No.

We have, however, suggested that before someone posts about how wrong something is, they actually get their facts straight.

This isn't negative toward you, it's a simple point.


I said in that quote, (In my opinion, I would find it sad for someone to worship the devil, rather than God. That means Janet, it is my own opinion - (which I am entitled to). It is not about getting facts straight. It is about MY OPINION. Which I am entitled to say.

And I've never disputed that right.

I've disputed things you have said as of fact.
Quote:


Quote:
Originally posted by janet

First off, since when is right and wrong determined by supermarket polls?


I used that as an example of (Joe public). I just mentioned a supermarket - thats all. It basically will give a good idea of what the majority think. Whether they are well versed is neither-here-nor-there. I am a member of Joe public on this forum who gives my opinion on the subject.


Fair enough. Apparently those who don't agree with you are somehow being mean to you, though?

Or those who point out that there are better ways of obtaining information than watching popular films, are being mean?
Quote:


Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Thirdly - I have to ask - who designed that questionnaire? ;)


Does it matter?

Yes, if you're trying to get accurate information.
Quote:


Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I never get to take these, by the way. I've yet to find a public-opinion poll that allows those who are actually employed in research or journalism to take it. We're on the list of barred professions. I wonder why that is?


I don't know...sorry!! I assumed that if your a journalist doing your shopping, they won't ask your profession before asking for your opinion

Every time I've been stopped by someone doing one of these, the first thing they ask is my profession and those of my immediate family.

Quote:

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

And the number you want, by the way, is 661, not 666. Unless you're talking Iron Maiden rather than theology.


I have never heard 661 as being the number for the Devil/Satan or Lucifer in my life. I would actually state a FACT, that if you asked a hundred people whether the number for the Devil is either '666' or '661', over 90% would say '666'. Is that a fair assessment Janet? confused2


There was a thread here about this not too long ago.

I don't honestly mind what people would say - I don't take my theology from supermarket polls or "what most people believe".

Quote:





Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I do wish you'd back that up with reputable sources. That doesn't include sensationalist media, btw.


I have recently heard about it on the televised news actually. Perhaps they were lying and made it all up as an April Fool joke confused2 But I doubt that and most would agree with me, soz.


A source, perhaps? A link to something?

Quote:


Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I suspect you are confounding a number of things, to be honest: muti is not the same thing as devil worship, for instance. Nor is santeria the same, by a long shot...


You keep bringing up these variants of Devil Worship,


No, I don't - niether of those are variants of devil worship at all.
Quote:


but to be honest, my thread just said (Devil worshippers) and my opinion on the subject. It is extremely nice of you to expand on the subject and mention other names and I am sure you have certainly spoke very wise on the expansion.



Quote:
Originally posted by janet

You choose not to think about it, which is your choice. I've had to research into it a bit for various reasons.


I am glad you agree. Why did you feel compelled to research the subject a bit? It appears that you are certainly more well-versed than most? unless it's a wickapedia job?



No, not quite. I don't write for wikipedia for a living.

I'm an academic.
Quote:




Quote:
Originally posted by janet

So - agreeing with you is Good and disagreeing is Evil?

Interesting take.

Not unusual, I grant you but I think unsupportable by the Christian ethics you want to claim....


Not at all Janet. You misunderstood my comment. I was actually talking about the comments and the (wording) within certain posts towards my good self and some other stuff as well. It sounded like a touch of forum bullying or perhaps ageism or even oneupmanship.


If you think you're being bullied, there's a report button - such things are not allowed here.

However, disagreeing with someone is not bullying them.


TooCute4Words - 6-3-2008 at 23:28

Quote:
Originally posted by giron
Could I just point out that it wasn't me! waggyfinger

If TC4W tells you differently, I'll ruddy kill 'im! lips_sealed


Your great giron waveysmiley I love your humour :)


giron - 6-3-2008 at 23:34

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


Your great giron waveysmiley


You're taking the pee, aren't you? waggyfinger

You are truly the product of the Devils loins! shocked_yellow

Have you no shame?


Badgergirl - 6-3-2008 at 23:45

You guys are getting me all exited! I can't wait 'till June now!

Maiden are doing their "Somewhere Back in Time" tour and are bound to sing "The Number of the Beast". I'll be there!

A large amound of their songs mentions Satan in some form, which has got them into trouble in the past. Pity people don't take time out to actually listen to the lyrics and realise they are AGAINST such actions.
Accused of Satanism, they wrote the song "Revalations". You'd have to hear it!

TC4W, if you say something is "Fact", it's better to provide some links. We've got some academic sorts here:D

Then again, even with some solid acedemia behind you, we'll still argue the Sun out of the Sky!


"And God said "Let there be light"
And Karlsforums said
"What Colour?"ilovekarls_f


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 00:41

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

The thread title said, 'Devil Worship'. As 'Satanism' was brought up, I just used that word. If it is different, then I stand corrected. The word 'Luciferianism' I have never heard of.

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

? It's been mentioned in this thread...
And not by me.


(fair enough..but who said it didn't matter. I said I had never heard of it before and I had said I shall stand corrected, okays)

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

I guess if you mentioned 'Lucifer', 'Satan' or the 'Devil to joe public, they would all say (names for the Devil). Would you agree that is a fair assessment?

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

I have no idea - I don't take my theology from popular opinion, nor do I see popular opinion as an arbiter of same...


(but as I am a member of Joe public and naturally not as aware as yourself or some others, then I would draw my conclusions in the same way as the majority would. You can of course educate those who don't know, or even tell them that they should be more educated or research more, but many would say (don't be so rude). I just gave my opinion of what I know already. many don't have a computer or have a book on Devil Worship to hand, agreed!!)

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

I said in that quote, (In my opinion, I would find it sad for someone to worship the devil, rather than God. That means Janet, it is my own opinion - (which I am entitled to). It is not about getting facts straight. It is about MY OPINION. Which I am entitled to say.

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

And I've never disputed that right.

I've disputed things you have said as of fact.


(That, you can do. As I can also give you my view of the situation. You can take it as it is and leave it at that, or you can progress further and make more of it than it already is. Perhaps carry it over to another thread on another occasion. Perhaps others can join in on the fun. Hardly setting a good example, but what goes with the daily flow, goes...I guess confused2)

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

I used that as an example of (Joe public). I just mentioned a supermarket - thats all. It basically will give a good idea of what the majority think. Whether they are well versed is neither-here-nor-there. I am a member of Joe public on this forum who gives my opinion on the subject.

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

Fair enough. Apparently those who don't agree with you are somehow being mean to you, though?

Or those who point out that there are better ways of obtaining information than watching popular films, are being mean?


(It is very obvious that reading up on Devil Worship is going to give you a better insight to what it is all about. There is indeed different types and areas of Devil Worship - from what I have read in this thread. But you must also understand that different members join this forum with different levels of expertees and many will just give their own opinion of the subject at hand, regardless of what others may offer in defence. It is like trying to tell a Muslim that his religion is rubbish. He may be very offended, regardless of evidence you may wish to present. Religion is a very touchy subject. )

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

Does it matter?

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

Yes, if you're trying to get accurate information.


(The reason I said, "Does it matter?", is because the majority will believe in the opposite of what you have pointed out within this thread. They may look at the evidence, but as they are worshippers of God and don't wish to know or even understand Devil Worship, they shall have their mind fixed away from what you present. You have to face that fact with religion and belief.)

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

I don't know...sorry!! I assumed that if your a journalist doing your shopping, they won't ask your profession before asking for your opinion

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

Every time I've been stopped by someone doing one of these, the first thing they ask is my profession and those of my immediate family.


(So you mean, that if you say you are a journalist, they may turn away and not bother asking, huh?)

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

I have never heard 661 as being the number for the Devil/Satan or Lucifer in my life. I would actually state a FACT, that if you asked a hundred people whether the number for the Devil is either '666' or '661', over 90% would say '666'. Is that a fair assessment Janet?

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

There was a thread here about this not too long ago.

I don't honestly mind what people would say - I don't take my theology from supermarket polls or "what most people believe".


(If someone chooses to believe in God and worship God - then you talk about Devil Worship and the fact that the number is '661' rather than '666', I doubt they'd even care - to be honest?)

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

I have recently heard about it on the televised news actually. Perhaps they were lying and made it all up as an April Fool joke But I doubt that and most would agree with me, soz.

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

A source, perhaps? A link to something?


(I'll find something for you on the net. but sadly, I haven't the time tonight :( But I'm sure you can believe very well, that a few individuals will perform such evil acts in the nameof the Devil. Of course, the ones who did that crime, were caught!! But what about those that don't huh?)

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

You keep bringing up these variants of Devil Worship,

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

No, I don't - niether of those are variants of devil worship at all.


Originally posted by TooCute4Words

I am glad you agree. Why did you feel compelled to research the subject a bit? It appears that you are certainly more well-versed than most? unless it's a wickapedia job?

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

No, not quite. I don't write for wikipedia for a living.

I'm an academic.


(I never said that you did work for wikipedia. What I actually said, is that it may be a wikipedia job - meaning, that the information presented in (post-form) may have been copied from such a website - not that it matters like, as I couldn't be bothered to check-up.)

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

Not at all Janet. You misunderstood my comment. I was actually talking about the comments and the (wording) within certain posts towards my good self and some other stuff as well. It sounded like a touch of forum bullying or perhaps ageism or even oneupmanship.

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

If you think you're being bullied, there's a report button - such things are not allowed here.

However, disagreeing with someone is not bullying them.


(I was actually saying a (touch of) bullying - (perhaps) ageism or oneupmanship. From that sentance, it means that maybe the latter two are not occuring, but could be?? but the (touch of) bullying kinda presents itself within this thread and a few others (I could mention). It's not a road I wish to go down actually.

I know about the report button thanks. I have no wish to press it on this occasion or really any other. I'd rather just sort it out via u2u, and if it all fails, I'll just leave the forum. (I can't be more honest than that - can I Janet?)


Redwolf5150 - 7-3-2008 at 00:54

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words

My reason for starting this thread, is because IMO I would find it sad for someone to spend their lives worshipping the Devil, rather than God.


Gee and what about Buddist and Native Americans who don't worship "God"?

Are they to be pitied too?

That is a pretty prejudiced viewpoint to have.

Just because someone choses to practice a religion different from yours are they automatically WRONG?

kewl_glasses


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 01:01

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words

My reason for starting this thread, is because IMO I would find it sad for someone to spend their lives worshipping the Devil, rather than God.


Gee and what about Buddist and Native Americans who don't worship "God"?

Are they to be pitied too?

That is a pretty prejudiced viewpoint to have.

Just because someone choses to practice a religion different from yours are they automatically WRONG?

kewl_glasses


If the subject matter was about Buddist or Native Americans, then I would air a view on that subject - if I so wished.

The subject matter is not about them it is about Devil Worshippers and I personally feel that worshiping the devil is wrong. It is not something I personally would ever care to do. I don't even care what is written in any book or on the web or even some documentary on TV. It is my own personal choice.

In Arab countries, you have to be very careful what you say about their beliefs. India is the same - among others.

We are lucky that we possess the luxury to debate these subjects in the way we do, without getting into a lot of bother.


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 01:03

Quote:
Originally posted by giron
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


Your great giron waveysmiley


You're taking the pee, aren't you? waggyfinger

You are truly the product of the Devils loins! shocked_yellow

Have you no shame?


Noooooooooooooooooooo not me :angel I'm up there with angels and their wings burn in the flames of hell


Redwolf5150 - 7-3-2008 at 01:05

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words

5) Redwolf will come out with the usual (nasty dig) rolls_eyes (nothing new there lol) 'Still thinkin' about the Copyright thread huh?? confused2

HUGE SNIP
To be honest....Anyone looking at this thread could certainly see the difference between Good and Evil from the posts (worded) within.


Hey, I give "nasty digs" to a lot of people, don't feel picked on.

Some people I just like to spar with. Take Scholar, for example. I've smacked him around a lot more than you and you don't hear him whining.

And I respect Scholar. At least he argues from a position of knowledge and stands by his position unless proven wrong. In which case he will stand corrected.

In this thread, on the other hand, you have argued from a position of ignorance and intolerance about something you know nothing about nor will have the courtesy of checking out the links people have kindly dug up for you.

Then you compound the problem by basically saying that people who don't worship "God" are bad.

And at the end (after the "Big Snip") you pretty much paint those of us who disagree with you as being "bad." I'm waiting for you to say we're all going to Hell for our opinion.

Don't take this as a nasty dig because it isn't intended as one. But you need to grow up and learn to tolerate people who are different from you. This huge world of ours is full of some really nice people who have absolutely nothing in common with you other than our kinship as humans.

Yet if you gave these different people a chance, you might actually grow to like them. Hell, you might even learn something along the way.

kewl_glasses


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 01:09

Quote:
Originally posted by Badgergirl
You guys are getting me all exited! I can't wait 'till June now!

Maiden are doing their "Somewhere Back in Time" tour and are bound to sing "The Number of the Beast". I'll be there!


Don't get crushed at the front lol ;)

They must be getting on now. They were very successful at their time. Loads of albums and singles and great packaging too.

Quote:
A large amound of their songs mentions Satan in some form, which has got them into trouble in the past. Pity people don't take time out to actually listen to the lyrics and realise they are AGAINST such actions.
Accused of Satanism, they wrote the song "Revalations". You'd have to hear it!


Their album and single covers were pretty horrific shocked_yellow All those picture discs they did. Some are pretty collectable now.

Quote:
TC4W, if you say something is "Fact", it's better to provide some links. We've got some academic sorts here:D

Then again, even with some solid acedemia behind you, we'll still argue the Sun out of the Sky!


"And God said "Let there be light"
And Karlsforums said
"What Colour?"ilovekarls_f


Yeah.....and I've had a bellyful of how things should be done huh :( If that was tried on the majority of the younger population of the Avril forum I also go on, it would be a rather nasty affair - I'll tell you. I'm pretty tolerant and give a fair response. Many on forums don't!!


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 01:39

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words

5) Redwolf will come out with the usual (nasty dig) rolls_eyes (nothing new there lol) 'Still thinkin' about the Copyright thread huh?? confused2

HUGE SNIP
To be honest....Anyone looking at this thread could certainly see the difference between Good and Evil from the posts (worded) within.


Hey, I give "nasty digs" to a lot of people, don't feel picked on.

I'm gettin' lazy tonight and tired, so I'll just reply quickly in BOLD smokin:

I've not been here long enough to know your past attacks, only your present ones towards my good self within threads. (I don't always reply to them actually) Just some snide stuff - rather un-necessary I would have thought :(


Some people I just like to spar with. Take Scholar, for example. I've smacked him around a lot more than you and you don't hear him whining.

He is probably well equipt with masses of knowledge on many subjects, so he can handle the grumpy wolf eh' ;) Anyway, it's unfair to mention your bouts with scholar within this thread really

And I respect Scholar. At least he argues from a position of knowledge and stands by his position unless proven wrong. In which case he will stand corrected.

I have actually admitted within this thread that I am prepared to stand corrected, but in regards to Devil Worshipping, it is never something I wish to partake in, regardless of documentation, etc..

If my view is that it is a bad thing to worship, I can state my opinion. If others wish to provide a reasonable argument (backed up with evidence) then fair enough. If I choose to stick to my guns and ignore it or whatever, then just leave it at that. No point making a meal of it and coming out with (allsorts) - not licorice allsorts btw :P


In this thread, on the other hand, you have argued from a position of ignorance and intolerance about something you know nothing about nor will have the courtesy of checking out the links people have kindly dug up for you.

I have given my opinion from what I have learnt in my life already - which I admit is very little. I saw the links and brushed through them. To be honest, I couldn't give a damn. (Like I said) it is something which doesn't interest me. I just thought it would make a good subject matter to debate. I am the type of member who just rushes in (full steam ahead). I don't really have time to think it all through, or really give a damn. Time moves really quickly and you know how exciting life is Redwolf ;) When I'm on here :angel But your way of dealing with debates shall differ to others. Then you talk about tolerance. It's a case of the saying, "Children should be seen...not heard" ain't it :o

Then you compound the problem by basically saying that people who don't worship "God" are bad.

I think that people shouldn't worship the Devil and also, I say that teaching your children such things is also bad. Many, many would agree. Just because on this forum, many wish to explore Devil worshipping a lot more than other places, thats fair enough. But I would rather suggest that believing and worshipping God is much better. Most priests would agree, I imagine

And at the end (after the "Big Snip") you pretty much paint those of us who disagree with you as being "bad." I'm waiting for you to say we're all going to Hell for our opinion.

I will never say that people should go to hell (quite literally) meaning (where the devil lives) NOT someone I just hate and I use that expression (Go to Hell) because I want them to get out of my sight like.

In regards to painting a picture of someone, I think you have already done that in regards to myself already - from what I have read here and there :(


Don't take this as a nasty dig because it isn't intended as one. But you need to grow up and learn to tolerate people who are different from you. This huge world of ours is full of some really nice people who have absolutely nothing in common with you other than our kinship as humans.

You don't hold back on your opinions, do you Redwolf confused2 I'll have to dig that book out on (tact and diplomacy) huh :D

Well I'll give you my opinion.

1) accept people for what they are and keep tight-lipped
2) refer to 1)


Yet if you gave these different people a chance, you might actually grow to like them. Hell, you might even learn something along the way.

kewl_glasses

I give everyone a chance, even you actually!! Many at the Avril forum wouldn't give you the time of day. Actually, they would join in a little group and keep digging back at you, until there is a big problem.

I - "on the otherhand" continue to make an effort, but I still have my own way of doing things and learning is actually one of them. But if I choose NOT to learn something about Devil Worship, then I shall damn well do as I choose on that particular subject.

Now thats a lesson from me to you ;)


DeWitch - 7-3-2008 at 04:59

TC4W
IMHO you have a very bigoted opinion.
You have been rude to both RedWolf and Janet but you complain of being bullied.
If you really "don't give a damn", as you stated in one of your very many posts here,
why do you keep pushing it?
AND THIS:
"Many at the Avril forum wouldn't give you the time of day. Actually, they would join in a little group and keep digging back at you, until there is a big problem. "
is so childish but more your speed I think.
Mainly I am a pacifist but I do speak up on occasion - so fire away boy
BUT - you will be alone in your tirades as I will ignore you.
Also I worship no one.
What do you think of that?
Don't bother answering because I REALLY don't give a damn.
I believe in live and let live and I preach to no one about their beliefs.


John_Little - 7-3-2008 at 09:48

TCFW, I'm on your side - or at least I was heading that way until your posts, like others here, started to be measured in forum feet rather than succint centimetres.

Short and sweet. This is a forum for goodess sake! not a phd thesis!

Life is too short for long posts.;)


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 10:33

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
TCFW, I'm on your side - or at least I was heading that way until your posts, like others here, started to be measured in forum feet rather than succint centimetres.

Short and sweet. This is a forum for goodess sake! not a phd thesis!

Life is too short for long posts.;)


I think I have see quite a few essays on this forum lol John ;) I usually write much smaller ones. But sadly within this thread my personality clashed with a few others and an argument broke out. I guess thats unusual on here huh confused2 Anyway, it's only one thread. All the others I've started or been involved in have been aye-okay :D perhaps a little jitter or two - 'now and again'

All this over 'Devil Worshipping' huh confused2 I guess it brought the devil out in us all. :P;)


John_Little - 7-3-2008 at 10:43

Now, that joke is pushing it too far. Your puns are getting worse than Simons!

Some of us have a delicate sense of humour.


Daz - 7-3-2008 at 10:46

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
I have actually admitted within this thread that I am prepared to stand corrected, but in regards to Devil Worshipping, it is never something I wish to partake in, regardless of documentation, etc..


But how can you be prepared to be corrected, if you won't read any of the evidence that points out to you, the other side of the coin, and that, maybe, just maybe, you actually don't know what you are talking about...??

<Snipped by me> Not wishing to cause further unnecessary upset.


John_Little - 7-3-2008 at 10:48

Ah.....the age card......

They're only jealous of your youth and your Avril avatar.


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 10:50

Quote:
Originally posted by DeWitch
TC4W

"Many at the Avril forum wouldn't give you the time of day. Actually, they would join in a little group and keep digging back at you, until there is a big problem. "
is so childish but more your speed I think.


I emboldened what you "really feel about me" :( No point elaborating really, is there.

Quote:
Mainly I am a pacifist but I do speak up on occasion - so fire away boy
BUT - you will be alone in your tirades as I will ignore you.


My emboldening above says it all really :( No point elaborating really, is there.

Quote:
Also I worship no one.
What do you think of that?
Don't bother answering because I REALLY don't give a damn.
I believe in live and let live and I preach to no one about their beliefs.


I have emboldened the only important part of that quote, (don't bother answering) so, I won't answer then.

Okay, I did go a bit over the top with my replies to Janet and Redwolf, but I was angry at being cross-examined and having my posts picked at in the way they were.

Anyway, I can move on from yesterday and look to a better today & tomorrow, if a couple or more can do the same. Of course, you (won't bother answering), so I guess I know how you really feel confused2

It's funny how one thread can change the feelings about one another. Or perhaps this was a 'grumpling appendix' heading towards the operating table. So best get those REAL hidden-feelings towards me 'out in the open', otherwise it could be peritonitis.


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 11:04

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
Now, that joke is pushing it too far. Your puns are getting worse than Simons!

Some of us have a delicate sense of humour.


I usually add a pun or two in many of my posts, hopefully trying to bring a bit of humour to the lives of those who choose to think so seriously.
-----------------------------------------

A man enters the gates of hell, he sees a horned creature before him and says, "Who the devil are you?"

The horned creature replies, "Who the devil do you think?"

The horned creature sticks his pitchfork in him, where the 'sun don't shine'

The man replies, "OUCH!! What the Hell do you think your doing?"

The horned creature replies, "What the Hell I like" and throws him into the flames for all eternity.
-----------------------------------------

The moral of that story is, don't ask the horned man stupid questions or polite questions - you know his intention anyway devilhot


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 11:11

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
I have actually admitted within this thread that I am prepared to stand corrected, but in regards to Devil Worshipping, it is never something I wish to partake in, regardless of documentation, etc..


Quote:
Originally posted by Daz

But how can you be prepared to be corrected, if you won't read any of the evidence that points out to you, the other side of the coin, and that, maybe, just maybe, you actually don't know what you are talking about...??


I have said that I brushed through some of the information in those links. 'Brushing through' means that I had a quick read through what was presented before me. So in effect, I did read a bit. But like I said Daz. It is not something which really interests me. I prefer to believe in God/Jesus and even the possibilities of after-life. That is my right Daz and you should allow me to choose that right, regardless of the information in those links.

It is like trying to convert someone from following Islam. You can present loads of documentation..etc.. etc.. but you won't get through.

Your comment, "I don't know what I'm talking about" is rather sad to read really. I don't even wish to elaborate much further on that one.


Quote:
Originally posted by Daz

For one so young, you've a very blinkered mindset, I wish you good luck with that, as you grow older...


Well thats rather an 'ageist' comment!! Where the hell did that come from, huh?


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 11:15

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
Ah.....the age card......

They're only jealous of your youth and your Avril avatar.


Must be? or 'something in the water'


DeWitch - 7-3-2008 at 12:59

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words

Quote:
Originally posted by Daz

For one so young, you've a very blinkered mindset, I wish you good luck with that, as you grow older...


Well thats rather an 'ageist' comment!! Where the hell did that come from, huh?


Maybe from here for just one of the few???
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
(I was actually saying a (touch of) bullying - (perhaps) ageism or oneupmanship. From that sentance, it means that maybe the latter two are not occuring, but could be?? but the (touch of) bullying kinda presents itself within this thread and a few others (I could mention). It's not a road I wish to go down actually.


janet - 7-3-2008 at 19:02

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

I have no idea - I don't take my theology from popular opinion, nor do I see popular opinion as an arbiter of same...


(but as I am a member of Joe public and naturally not as aware as yourself or some others, then I would draw my conclusions in the same way as the majority would. You can of course educate those who don't know, or even tell them that they should be more educated or research more, but many would say (don't be so rude). I just gave my opinion of what I know already. many don't have a computer or have a book on Devil Worship to hand, agreed!!)


I assume you'd draw your conclusions based on your own thoughts, rather than those of the majority.

I haven't said that anyone should be more educated.
Quote:




(That, you can do. As I can also give you my view of the situation. You can take it as it is and leave it at that, or you can progress further and make more of it than it already is. Perhaps carry it over to another thread on another occasion. Perhaps others can join in on the fun. Hardly setting a good example, but what goes with the daily flow, goes...I guess confused2)


This is a discussion forum. In which discussion takes place.

Discussion is includes disagreeing with someone.

So far, you've said I've been rude and that I'm not setting a good example.... I can't see how either of those is true, unless asking you to back up statements is rude.
Quote:


Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

Fair enough. Apparently those who don't agree with you are somehow being mean to you, though?

Or those who point out that there are better ways of obtaining information than watching popular films, are being mean?


(It is very obvious that reading up on Devil Worship is going to give you a better insight to what it is all about. There is indeed different types and areas of Devil Worship - from what I have read in this thread. But you must also understand that different members join this forum with different levels of expertees and many will just give their own opinion of the subject at hand, regardless of what others may offer in defence.

I have nowhere queried your opinion. If you look, I've asked you to back up things you have said are fact.

The two are different.
Quote:



(The reason I said, "Does it matter?", is because the majority will believe in the opposite of what you have pointed out within this thread. They may look at the evidence, but as they are worshippers of God and don't wish to know or even understand Devil Worship, they shall have their mind fixed away from what you present. You have to face that fact with religion and belief.)


See, that's part of why I'm a teacher and a researcher. I spent the day working with a group of people who now have more information and are better able to do what they want to do, because of the work my colleagues and I have done. I'd rather work to change things that just sit back and say they won't change.

As for facts - the majority opinion does not make something a fact.
Quote:



(So you mean, that if you say you are a journalist, they may turn away and not bother asking, huh?)

No, I meant what I said.
Quote:



(If someone chooses to believe in God and worship God - then you talk about Devil Worship and the fact that the number is '661' rather than '666', I doubt they'd even care - to be honest?)

That depends on the person.
Quote:


(I'll find something for you on the net. but sadly, I haven't the time tonight :( But I'm sure you can believe very well, that a few individuals will perform such evil acts in the nameof the Devil. Of course, the ones who did that crime, were caught!! But what about those that don't huh?)

I'll look forward to a reasonable source...
Quote:


Originally posted by TooCute4Words

You keep bringing up these variants of Devil Worship,

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

No, I don't - niether of those are variants of devil worship at all.


Originally posted by TooCute4Words

I am glad you agree. Why did you feel compelled to research the subject a bit? It appears that you are certainly more well-versed than most? unless it's a wickapedia job?

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

No, not quite. I don't write for wikipedia for a living.

I'm an academic.


(I never said that you did work for wikipedia. What I actually said, is that it may be a wikipedia job - meaning, that the information presented in (post-form) may have been copied from such a website - not that it matters like, as I couldn't be bothered to check-up.)


No, it's not from wikipedia - since I've posted links to other sites and suggested other sources, that might have been obvious.
Quote:


(I was actually saying a (touch of) bullying - (perhaps) ageism or oneupmanship. From that sentance, it means that maybe the latter two are not occuring, but could be?? but the (touch of) bullying kinda presents itself within this thread and a few others (I could mention). It's not a road I wish to go down actually.

I work in and around schools. I have a fair idea of what bullying is.

Saying, "Your facts don't add up" or "I disagree with you" is not bullying.

If you want a thread in which no one disagrees with you, posting in RSE is not the best idea - this forum exists for discussion.
Quote:


I know about the report button thanks. I have no wish to press it on this occasion or really any other. I'd rather just sort it out via u2u, and if it all fails, I'll just leave the forum. (I can't be more honest than that - can I Janet?)


I have no idea - I don't know you.

I'm rather amazed that someone disagreeing with you might cause you to leave a forum but that's your decision.


janet - 7-3-2008 at 19:06

And just as a point - I have nowhere, ever, suggested that anyone be involved in satanism, etc.

I rather resent the implication that I have, or the constant questions as to why I've researched this subject. Anyone who has read much on this forum will be able to figure it out, I suspect - it goes with the territory of a lot of what I have done.

Nor do I see knowing about these things as antithetical to being a Christian.

Short enough, John? :)


Redwolf5150 - 7-3-2008 at 19:20

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
It's funny how one thread can change the feelings about one another. Or perhaps this was a 'grumpling appendix' heading towards the operating table. So best get those REAL hidden-feelings towards me 'out in the open', otherwise it could be peritonitis.


Personally I have nothing against you one way or the other. The majority of the threads you start are of no interest to me. If I were the real troll you think I am I'd have let you have it for some of the more "off the wall" ones you have started in the past.

But in this case, as others have pointed out, you started a thread in a discussion forum. As such you should have been prepared for those poeple who question your thinking and your (lack of) facts.

You also should not be surprised that people tried to correct your way of thinking by posting links to information that would have allowed you to possibly reevaluate your thoughts on the subject a little.

And you certainly should not have been surprised by the response your unwillingness to check this information out rained down on your head. After all, many of us who have responded in this thread are accustomed to doing research as part of our job. In the course of doing research you either prove or disprove what you are attempting to study.

You, on the other hand, have steadfastly stuck to a narrow-minded, uninformed and inaccurate opinion based on faulty information. We all get that you would never worship satan. Nobody here is trying to get you to light candles in a graveyard after midnight.

All we are trying to do is get you to broaden your knowledge base a little.

Seeing as that is obviously failing, I'll withdraw from the discussion, too, rather than get angry and say some things that might be construed as bullying.

kewl_glasses


scholar - 7-3-2008 at 19:50

TooCute, I hope the strong feelings and criticisms you have drawn in this thread do not discourage you from posting. I think you started with a fairly superficial pop-culture knowledge and some intuition of what you thought the subject of devil worship might entail, and tripped into the briar-patch of people with real-life knowledge and/or personal beliefs of people who have been misunderstood and/or badly treated for beliefs and practices that are not mainstream, and not represented accurately by movies and television.

If you want a safer topic, I don't think we have any members or relatives of members who are werewolves.scared_stiff scared_stiffscared_stiff


Redwolf5150 - 7-3-2008 at 19:52

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
They're only jealous of your youth and your Avril avatar.


Hardly.

That is one of the WORST photos of the lady I have ever seen, IMHO.

kewl_glasses


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 21:20

Quote:
Originally posted by scholar
TooCute, I hope the strong feelings and criticisms you have drawn in this thread do not discourage you from posting.


It would take a lot more than one disagreement in one thread to ever do that. I am a tough cookie and believe-you-me, if I was really annoyed, I could easily turn up the heat - but I am quite restrained really, but still reactional...so I might drop an odd comment which may get a hostile response. But I might crawl out of it skidaddle (alive - I hope);)

Quote:
I think you started with a fairly superficial pop-culture knowledge and some intuition of what you thought the subject of devil worship might entail, and tripped into the briar-patch of people with real-life knowledge and/or personal beliefs of people who have been misunderstood and/or badly treated for beliefs and practices that are not mainstream, and not represented accurately by movies and television.


Thats a fair assessment of the situation scholar. You are very intuitive.

I don't actually think hard about each and every subject matter I wish to start a thread on. My aim is to start threads, post on other threads and give my opinion - (whether educated or uneducated) - (Whether based on facts or based on opinion). I always will state exactly where the source of my information comes from - if asked (nicely) or otherwise.

In regards to this specific thread, just read through it from the beginning and it's pretty well self explanitory (from my end). I understand I will receive criticism and views on the subject at hand, as this is a messageboard forum and this subject is a serious debate.

I am not really a VERY serious person. I am happy to add a bit of flair and comedy to a post at any time. I don't really spend ANY time reading books or reading pages from the internet as my comprehention skills/memory skills are not exactly brilliant. I think that is pretty evident. But not really a problem for anyone with an understanding of people. People are all different and on a forum, you will meet all types of person. Some have better skills than others. Some may be disabled in some way or some may be expert in some subjects and lousy in others - the list goes on and on.

I was VERY annoyed at some of the comments I have read in this thread. I can easily point them out, but I'm sure you've read them - as (most others have) and I felt that some were'nt necessary. It was some of the comments on page 1 & 2 which lead to the next two pages (Basically members prodding at me) on pages 3 & 4. I thought this was a discussion forum talking about the subject at hand - Devil Worshippers. But instead, it looked more like a tag-team of longstanding members picking at myself and my inhibility to understand enough about the subject at hand and having my reasons questioned.

I have explained that I choose NOT to read about Devil Worship at length - as I am not into reading books and pages and pages on the net because it makes me go boggle-eyed. I did however admit that I brushed through some of the stuff shown and pretty much gave away to you all, that I was indeed not going to pursue this subject to great length in understanding the subject - but there was un-necessary jibes about my - age, lack of knowledge, etc.. etc.. I do expect some comments, but I felt this tag-team went over the top - a bit. I have read the whole thread again - just now and I can see exactly where it started to go wrong and also when I got annoyed. Things do go down hill from situations like that and they did on this thread.

Quote:
If you want a safer topic, I don't think we have any members or relatives of members who are werewolves.scared_stiff scared_stiffscared_stiff


Haha!! a little 'Wolf' sneaky quip ;) (Thats what I'm like) just slip in a little comedy - 'here or there' but some assume it is NOT comedy, but actually a nasty jibe. I guess thats where things can go wrong. It's like the words, "Patronising", "Condescending", "Sarcasm" can get mistaken as something else. I shall fall into that trap - more often than not.

In regards to (safer topics) I venture into any territory and go with the flow - wherever it takes me.

(laughter) one minute, (seriousness) the next and (warzone), which I face now!! Well, not so bad really :P


janet - 7-3-2008 at 21:41

Tell you what, TCFW.

I'll just assume that you don't want discussion, but only a place to post your views, rather than discuss them.

(As for werewolves - I teach about many areas of mythology, including werewolves and vampires.... so while I doubt we have many members who are lycanthropes, I'd be surprised if I was the only one who had at least a passing interest in the literature.


Redwolf5150 - 7-3-2008 at 22:04

Interesting.

*as he hikes leg and wets 2cutes' trouser leg*

Ya know, I always get a little strange around the full moon myself. You think I might suffer from that?

roffle


Redwolf5150 - 7-3-2008 at 22:08

Actually I'm pretty strange all the time.

Guess that rules THAT out.

*hands 2cute a towel and quotes John Belusi from Animal House"

"Sorry"

:D


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 22:34

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I assume you'd draw your conclusions based on your own thoughts, rather than those of the majority.


My own thoughts are, believing in God and not worshipping the Devil. No more or no less than that really. I make that choice - regardless of what others choose or what is written in books or on the net. The majority would agree with me. (Logic and an educated guess) would tell me that the majority would follow suit.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I haven't said that anyone should be more educated.


Fair enough Janet. I choose NOT to educate myself anymore on the subject of Devil Worship, as it doesn't interest me. I started the thread to see what other people would think, but instead....The subject matter changed to me rolls_eyes

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

This is a discussion forum. In which discussion takes place.


I am aware of what it is Janet. I have been on a few and met many members with different view-points and different attitudes and different tolerance levels to each and every situation. I have also debated with members on the Avril forum who say they are 12 years old, but are actually 8 years old and some go ape-sh*t over the smallest of things. I also know older members in their 50's and 60's who like to pick at members who fail miserably at debates and make them feel very low indeed. Very unwelcoming actually.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Discussion is includes disagreeing with someone.


It is how you disagree with someone that matters. I shall admit that in this thread I may have over-reacted, but I am not the only one who has spoilt a decent discussion on a subject matter and turned it into a rather attacking scenario.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

So far, you've said I've been rude and that I'm not setting a good example.... I can't see how either of those is true, unless asking you to back up statements is rude.


I said,

Perhaps carry it over to another thread on another occasion. Perhaps others can join in on the fun. Hardly setting a good example

I used the word, 'Perhaps', because I have felt that after our heated discussion on this thread and some of the remarks made within this thread, that it may start up again - elsewhere on another thread (all in the same way) I use the word, 'Perhaps' as it may not happen. (Hopefully not!!) I prefer threads to talk about the subject at hand - rather than a member and his or her faults!! I am sure you have read the whole thread from beginning to end and made your own mind up. I assume it won't tally with what I am thinking right now.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I have nowhere queried your opinion. If you look, I've asked you to back up things you have said are fact.

The two are different.


I said that I think Devil Worship is not something I wish to worship or be a part of. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone - regardless of what is written in a book or the net. I can do that - if I wish. You can critcise my decision - if you wish and you have.

I can't disprove what you have indeed proven by the links you have posted within this thread - I would never do that, as that would be foolish - agreed!! So for myself to disprove that and present facts to back up that claim would be impossible. I can give my own opinion on the matter and you can accept that. You can (and have) presented the evidence (in the form of links) that there is more about the subject at hand and I am sure the posters (within this thread) would appreciate that - 'as do I, actually'. But I am not changing my viewpoint and have told you and others why!!

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

See, that's part of why I'm a teacher and a researcher. I spent the day working with a group of people who now have more information and are better able to do what they want to do, because of the work my colleagues and I have done. I'd rather work to change things that just sit back and say they won't change.


I have read through quite a few of your posts on this forum Janet and I would be a liar if I said they are nothing short of pure brilliance. I wish I had the ability to word things in the same manner as you do yourself. You can (not only) word things well, you also have the proper grammar and literacy skills to match and the knowledge. But some others won't possess those same skills or be able to write posts as well. Many people may also choose to stray away from debates because they may be picked upon, so they just leave the professionals to debate. I have seen this on the Avril forum, where some innocent younger member gives it a go and suddely they are trodden on by some BIG HEAVY DOC MARTIN BOOT shocked_yellow. If that happens, I always step in and make them feel guilty of what they have done, as it's not really fair. Believe-you-me Janet. I have had to put up with Way-worse than I have experienced here, so I deal with it none-the-less in my unique style :D

Another point - worth mentioning. When you know someone has their mind made up, it can be better to just accept that they are not likely to listen further on that subject at hand. But on another subject - they may be swayed? I am like that - so please don't judge the rest of my time here by what you have read in this thread okays waveysmiley

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

As for facts - the majority opinion does not make something a fact.


I know that. But if the majority hate or support something, then it generally happens. I am in the majority of Non-Devil Worshippers and I shall stay there. Regardless of facts that May sway others.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I'll look forward to a reasonable source...


The source I shall try to provide will probably be from a newspaper article - stating that a person was killed due to an individual deciding to kill a person in the name of the Devil. I would expect you to argue that this is probably an isolated incident and the person who commited that crime may have had serious mental problems anyway.

We can all argue about reasons for why people do things, can't we?

But only the person themselves can know why.

Quote:
Originally posted by Janet

No, I don't - niether of those are variants of devil worship at all.


Okay. But the Devil is also called Satin or Lucifer. I'm just asking you a civil question here BTW.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

No, it's not from wikipedia - since I've posted links to other sites and suggested other sources, that might have been obvious.


I saw the links and clicked on them. I was aware they were NOT from wikipedia. I did say that you may have got your original knowledge from wikipedia and perhaps used some of that as your source information? it was mearly a possibility and I just queried it - thats all. (nothing more)

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I work in and around schools. I have a fair idea of what bullying is.


I'm glad to hear that. Bullying is a serious problem and much of it goes un-reported and much of it is hidden. There are also different types of bullying - forum bullying (for instance)

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

Saying, "Your facts don't add up" or "I disagree with you" is not bullying.


I wasn't singling out yourself. Five people can enter a room and one of them can have a heated discussion with someone and it's all okay. But then others add to that and all of a sudden, you have five against one. But one or two may be trying to cause a bit of a flame - it's not always easy to tell. We experience quite a bit of that on the Avril forum. Usually banned members returning under a guise - with dishonest intentions to start a bit of a problem.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

If you want a thread in which no one disagrees with you, posting in RSE is not the best idea - this forum exists for discussion.


Any thread in any section which tackles a serious or semi-serious subject matter can lead to disagreements. I certainly don't need a lesson on that. But I do get annoyed when certain comments about my age and other stuff get's mentioned in a thread and two pages worth of knitpicking about myself and stuff gets aired (the way it does here). Big things start from little things, eh'

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I have no idea - I don't know you.


I know you don't. I don't know anyone here.

Quote:
Originally posted by janet

I'm rather amazed that someone disagreeing with you might cause you to leave a forum but that's your decision.


I know it's my decision.

I would only leave if I felt things had got way out of control and the moderator team completely wanted me out and then I would just go.

Or, if I was banned for reason, 'X'

'X' being (any reason the Admin chose at a particular time) I hope I never give them a reason to ban me. I enjoy this place and wish to get on with everybody, but that's never easy. So if 80% to 90% can be at least achieved, I'll have to settle for that. But 100% would be better and that includes you Janet. I don't want to fall out over this silly thread. :)


John_Little - 7-3-2008 at 23:48

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Short enough, John? :)

Much more in tune with my attention span, Janet. but TCFW appears to be a lost cause now.


janet - 7-3-2008 at 23:51

Well, lost or not, one I shall leave well alone in the future. :)


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 23:54

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little

but TCFW appears to be a lost cause now.


What does that mean John?


TooCute4Words - 7-3-2008 at 23:55

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Well, lost or not, one I shall leave well alone in the future. :)


I see this comment was ignored,

But 100% would be better and that includes you Janet. I don't want to fall out over this silly thread.


John_Little - 7-3-2008 at 23:56

If the emails I get about increasing the length of my appendage worked as well as what ever you've been taking to increase the length of your last post, people would be queueing to buy what ever it was.

Edit: ish


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 00:00

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
If the emails I get about increasing the length of my appendage worked as well as what ever you've been taking to increase the length of your posts, people would be queueing to buy what ever it was.

Edit: ish


I see.

So you have received the odd e-mail about increasing the length of your posts, as they were a little short and sweet, rather than lengthy essays huh confused2

But, my ones in this thread have been a little on the lengthy side, huh confused2 Well, out of the many posts I have done, most of them aren't that long really, so perhaps I could be excused on that basis.

It depends on the person excusing...I guess confused2


John_Little - 8-3-2008 at 00:02

Odd!????

My inbox reads longer than this thread with spam emails commenting on my manhood. How my girl will never be satisfied and how I cant be a man because I dont smoke the same cigarettes......Sorry, that was the stones. Got carried away there for a second.


janet - 8-3-2008 at 00:05

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Well, lost or not, one I shall leave well alone in the future. :)


I see this comment was ignored,

But 100% would be better and that includes you Janet. I don't want to fall out over this silly thread.


Ok, against my better judgement I'll answer this.

We can't fall out.

We are not friends.

We are people who post to the same forum.

That's all. There is nothing to fall out *from*.


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 00:05

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
Odd!????

My inbox reads longer than this thread with spam emails commenting on my manhood.


Well keep the two nice ones from 'myself' and 'Redwolf' :P;)

Then delete the other 698 from those nasty spammers commenting on your womanhood, I mean 'Manhood' :Pskidaddle


janet - 8-3-2008 at 00:06

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
... how I cant be a man because I dont smoke the same cigarettes......Sorry, that was the stones. Got carried away there for a second.


Earworm!!

Is that a nice thing to do at this time of night? ;)


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 00:07

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Well, lost or not, one I shall leave well alone in the future. :)


I see this comment was ignored,

But 100% would be better and that includes you Janet. I don't want to fall out over this silly thread.


Ok, against my better judgement I'll answer this.

We can't fall out.

We are not friends.

We are people who post to the same forum.

That's all. There is nothing to fall out *from*.


Thanks for replying & thanks for your honesty. I sincerly believe you meant every word of it. So did I. :)


John_Little - 8-3-2008 at 00:11

Good.

Now, that's what I call "short".


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 00:13

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
Good.

Now, that's what I call "short".


'I' :D


John_Little - 8-3-2008 at 00:14

Doh!

Out done again!


Redwolf5150 - 8-3-2008 at 01:49

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
Odd!????

My inbox reads longer than this thread with spam emails commenting on my manhood. How my girl will never be satisfied and how I cant be a man because I dont smoke the same cigarettes......Sorry, that was the stones. Got carried away there for a second.


You should ask Giron for some of the little blue pills he's been buying from the spam in his email.

:D


Redwolf5150 - 8-3-2008 at 01:51

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Well, lost or not, one I shall leave well alone in the future. :)


I see this comment was ignored,

But 100% would be better and that includes you Janet. I don't want to fall out over this silly thread.


Ok, against my better judgement I'll answer this.

We can't fall out.

We are not friends.

We are people who post to the same forum.

That's all. There is nothing to fall out *from*.


But you and I Janet, we'll always have Frankfort (Kentucky, that is).

:D


Redwolf5150 - 8-3-2008 at 01:51

Quote:
Originally posted by John_Little
Doh!

Out done again!


Guess you got the long AND the short of that exchange.

:D


DeWitch - 8-3-2008 at 03:29

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
The majority would agree with me. (Logic and an educated guess) would tell me that the majority would follow suit.


I am so very happy that "the majority" does not rule me.
I live for me and mine and do not give a hoot about what anyone else - and especially what "the majority" thinks.


Daz - 8-3-2008 at 07:41

Quote:
Originally posted by DeWitch
I am so very happy that "the majority" does not rule me.
I live for me and mine and do not give a hoot about what anyone else - and especially what "the majority" thinks.


Yeah, have to agree with that DW.

Nothing will be forced upon my little'un, he's free to choose whatever he wants, and definately no pressure from us regarding religion/devil worshipping et al...

There is of course one caveat...

His choice of football (Soccer if you must!) team..... He will support his local team, and not be a "Plastic"or "Glory Hunter" !!! :D kewl_glasses smokin: :D


janet - 8-3-2008 at 10:50

Wry grin...

When I was teaching religions of the world, I used to get the students to say how they decided if something was a religion - while my cotutor sat quietly, taking notes.

What she was *really* doing was listing what the students said against football - and it was amazing how often the entire list could be attributed to really die hard football fans!

It made a good talking point...


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 11:08

Quote:
Originally posted by DeWitch
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
The majority would agree with me. (Logic and an educated guess) would tell me that the majority would follow suit.


I am so very happy that "the majority" does not rule me.
I live for me and mine and do not give a hoot about what anyone else - and especially what "the majority" thinks.


The majority doesn't rule me either. At no point in this entire thread did I say that - or 'would I say that'. I mearly point out that I (a person) who chooses NOT to worship the Devil, would have a majority vote in my favour. 'That is all I said really'.

Just thought I'd clear that up - just in case somebody or more assumed otherwise and had'nt read the whole thread because of it's <length> :P


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 11:52

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150

Personally I have nothing against you one way or the other.


Sorry for my delay in replying to you Redwolf. But yesterday was a busy day smokin:

I am glad you have nothing against me. So I assume that every time you brought my age or lack of (whatever) into a debate or convo on this board, that it is just a bit of banter - like 'giron' or 'scholar' lets say... Well I'm glad to hear that, as I have nothing personal against you - nor do I wish to, unless I was given reason to. But that would be from your side - rather than mine, as I would choose not to instigate it

Quote:
The majority of the threads you start are of no interest to me.


Thats fair comment. I also find quite a few threads on here difficult to debate on, as I see that quite a few are to do with American stuff and much I don't know, so I just debate and chat in others - thats generally the way with most forums.

Quote:
If I were the real troll you think I am I'd have let you have it for some of the more "off the wall" ones you have started in the past.


I never said that you were a troll. I am also aware that you could turn up the heat if you wanted to, just as I could. But it is not about doing that, it is who has the free pass onto the road to oblivion that worries me shocked_yellow

Quote:
But in this case, as others have pointed out, you started a thread in a discussion forum. As such you should have been prepared for those poeple who question your thinking and your (lack of) facts.


I know about discussion forums and I gave away my lack of knowledge quite easily. I was very upfront with it and didn't claim to know something which I didn't know. My references to 'Sabrina the teenage witch' and 'the Omen' were just a bit of a jest. I felt that would be obvious, but looking further down the thread, I can see that many assumed I was being serious. The thing is Redwolf - whether I had the knowledge or not. The information about Devil Worship, etc.. was available in those links within the thread. So anything else didn't matter really. My mind was already made up about Devil Worship from beginning to end and remains unchanged. Not something I wish to partake in. That should be a fair statement (regardless of what others think) majority or minority.

Quote:
You also should not be surprised that people tried to correct your way of thinking by posting links to information that would have allowed you to possibly reevaluate your thoughts on the subject a little.


It was no surprise actually. Remember that it was I that posted the original link in the OP. All the information given to be wasn't going to re-evaluate my thoughts on the subject a little, because it is a place I wish to NOT go to. I prefer to think of God, jesus and (such like). I understand that there is a section in our society who wish to venture into Devil Worship, Satanism, etc.. etc.. (but not I) and I should be respected for my own opinion (regardless of other evidence) provided for by various links.

Quote:
And you certainly should not have been surprised by the response your unwillingness to check this information out rained down on your head. After all, many of us who have responded in this thread are accustomed to doing research as part of our job. In the course of doing research you either prove or disprove what you are attempting to study.


My unwillingness to look over the 'information given' was explained away by myself in previous posts - pages 1 & 2 (if I remember rightly). Pages 3 & 4 (onwards) are kind of picking on me and banter rolls_eyes (this thread could go on as long as the Late Night Club) if we're not careful ;) Call it 'the Devil's Club' :P

I know that a lot of you do research and have the ability to read, comprehend and understand very quickly. I on the otherhand tend to be lacking in that department <somewhat> so I do the best I can. But basically, I don't take life as seriously as many may do on here and other forums. I like to thow in some giron quips (here or there) and everybody loves 'giron', even though LSemmens warned me about the Birch he has skidaddle

Quote:
You, on the other hand, have steadfastly stuck to a narrow-minded, uninformed and inaccurate opinion based on faulty information.


You are talking about fictional movies and opinions based on supermarket polls, right?? I have actually said that my mind remains unchanged on the matter - regardless of information within links (whether true or not) I mearly pointed out about the majority agreeing with me and also, these fictional movies - but based on stuff written in the bible and elsewhere.

Nobody alive has met God or the Devil. Nobody can visually see Radio waves either. I haven't seen the Loch Ness monster, or life on other planets next to other suns in other galaxies, but I trust what Astronomers say - because they are experts in their fields. I believe that some people can believe there is some good in Devil Worship for those who wish to partake in that subject and read up on it, but for me - my mind is fixed.

Quote:
We all get that you would never worship satan. Nobody here is trying to get you to light candles in a graveyard after midnight.


I hate the cold and graveyards and the dark, afraid of ghosts and insects reside in graveyards, so. byeeeeeeeeeshocked_yellow :P

Quote:
All we are trying to do is get you to broaden your knowledge base a little.


It's the references to my age and my inhibilty to either listen or understand or read which is having a negative effect to replies in posts. Much of which is un-necessary. I do offer a cheeky-boy image on here and add banter along the way within threads. This is pretty much myself in serious mode. But Cockney geezer, cheeky chappy may come across - run up and slap you where the sun don't shine, hehe!!:P

Quote:
Seeing as that is obviously failing, I'll withdraw from the discussion, too, rather than get angry and say some things that might be construed as bullying.

kewl_glasses


You ickle fibber nananana You are back in the thread and having some fun :D (I know what it's like - don't worry) :P

If you choose to bully, you will get Dreamweavers chainsaw up your **** (Well I've read a bit........;)) I hear LSemmens is even sharper, so I shall realllly behave :D

Come on Redwolf, no need to let this thread and the Copyright thread cause endless problems between us, does it?

Oh

p.s/ This is another essay. I tend to do this, so you'll get bored at moaning at me :P Well.....I hope so. These things take time. I was going to add some rude jokes too, but I'll save them smokin:


Daz - 8-3-2008 at 12:33

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Wry grin...

When I was teaching religions of the world, I used to get the students to say how they decided if something was a religion - while my cotutor sat quietly, taking notes.

What she was *really* doing was listing what the students said against football - and it was amazing how often the entire list could be attributed to really die hard football fans!

It made a good talking point...


:)

Football is my religion, St James Park is my Church....

(The real St James Park, not that Geordie imitation one!)


Badgergirl - 8-3-2008 at 12:58

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by Badgergirl
You guys are getting me all exited! I can't wait 'till June now!

Maiden are doing their "Somewhere Back in Time" tour and are bound to sing "The Number of the Beast". I'll be there!


Don't get crushed at the front lol ;)

They must be getting on now. They were very successful at their time. Loads of albums and singles and great packaging too.

Quote:
A large amound of their songs mentions Satan in some form, which has got them into trouble in the past. Pity people don't take time out to actually listen to the lyrics and realise they are AGAINST such actions.
Accused of Satanism, they wrote the song "Revalations". You'd have to hear it!


Their album and single covers were pretty horrific shocked_yellow All those picture discs they did. Some are pretty collectable now.

Quote:
TC4W, if you say something is "Fact", it's better to provide some links. We've got some academic sorts here:D

Then again, even with some solid acedemia behind you, we'll still argue the Sun out of the Sky!


"And God said "Let there be light"
And Karlsforums said
"What Colour?"ilovekarls_f


Yeah.....and I've had a bellyful of how things should be done huh :( If that was tried on the majority of the younger population of the Avril forum I also go on, it would be a rather nasty affair - I'll tell you. I'm pretty tolerant and give a fair response. Many on forums don't!!



Again speaking from ignorence, they are STILL the most successful, biggest selling "Heavy Metal" band (Heavy Rock, Rock, Prog Metal...whatever!) on the go!
But I'll forgive you, since you appreciate the Eddie Art!


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 13:16

Quote:
Originally posted by Badgergirl
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by Badgergirl
You guys are getting me all exited! I can't wait 'till June now!

Maiden are doing their "Somewhere Back in Time" tour and are bound to sing "The Number of the Beast". I'll be there!


Don't get crushed at the front lol ;)

They must be getting on now. They were very successful at their time. Loads of albums and singles and great packaging too.

Quote:
A large amound of their songs mentions Satan in some form, which has got them into trouble in the past. Pity people don't take time out to actually listen to the lyrics and realise they are AGAINST such actions.
Accused of Satanism, they wrote the song "Revalations". You'd have to hear it!


Their album and single covers were pretty horrific shocked_yellow All those picture discs they did. Some are pretty collectable now.

Quote:
TC4W, if you say something is "Fact", it's better to provide some links. We've got some academic sorts here:D

Then again, even with some solid acedemia behind you, we'll still argue the Sun out of the Sky!


"And God said "Let there be light"
And Karlsforums said
"What Colour?"ilovekarls_f


Yeah.....and I've had a bellyful of how things should be done huh :( If that was tried on the majority of the younger population of the Avril forum I also go on, it would be a rather nasty affair - I'll tell you. I'm pretty tolerant and give a fair response. Many on forums don't!!



Again speaking from ignorence, they are STILL the most successful, biggest selling "Heavy Metal" band (Heavy Rock, Rock, Prog Metal...whatever!) on the go!
But I'll forgive you, since you appreciate the Eddie Art!


I never said they were'nt the (most) successful or biggest selling (Heavy Metal) band of all time. I would of thought that Black Sabbath and Led Zeppelin would be pretty close - perhaps even biggerconfused2 but I guess I must be Ignorant huh lips_sealed I also said that they were successful at their time and they must be getting on now. The reason I said that, is because 'single' sales were much better in those days. Anyone trying to make that sort of money today would be struggling some what.

Today, it is bands like Metallica who are taking over. Especially with the younger audience - but even they are old-school now. (doesn't time fly - eh') :P

The Eddie art was magnificent. I guess that was a good selling ploy, appealing to those moshers ;)


LSemmens - 8-3-2008 at 13:21

Having read all of the posts in this thread, TCFW, I am leaning towards the views espoused by Janet and Redwolf, both of whom are "experts" in their fields. Their main requests to you have been to back up some of your statements with fact. These have been largely ignored and, as such, you do come across as a youth who is willing to discuss a subject, as long as those with whom you are talking, agree. I was once like that myself. This is not meant as anything other than my observation.

[Thread drift alert]
Be warned, you'll now find that DW's Kill1 is as sharp as my own, I spent a good hour on it today! :king) [/Thread drift alert]


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 13:38

Quote:
Originally posted by LSemmens
Having read all of the posts in this thread, TCFW, I am leaning towards the views espoused by Janet and Redwolf, both of whom are "experts" in their fields. Their main requests to you have been to back up some of your statements with fact. These have been largely ignored and, as such, you do come across as a youth who is willing to discuss a subject, as long as those with whom you are talking, agree. I was once like that myself. This is not meant as anything other than my observation.


I think we shall all have to (agree to disagree) and move on. Otherwise this argument/discussion/whatever rolls_eyes will go on forever. Also, it is a 'politically correct' thing to agree with longer standing members anyroads. So even if you felt that we <all> should know better than to air (these type) of views 'publicly' and in the way - it was done. After all, this thread went well off-topic and into oblivion..way way back to page two.

You say, " I was once like that myself. ". You are as young as you feel you know ;) Nothing wrong with making an error. It's harder for a 'moderator' though, as they are meant to make a great example to others with words of infinite wisdom :D

Quote:
[Thread drift alert]
Be warned, you'll now find that DW's Kill1 is as sharp as my own, I spent a good hour on it today! :king) [/Thread drift alert]


And here's the (words of wisdom) shocked_yellowshocked_yellow;)


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 13:39

.double post.


LSemmens - 8-3-2008 at 13:58

You'll find QT, that I have been known to give "more senior" members some grief, too. So I'm not just picking on you. Nor was I suggesting that you were young, I am observing that you come across as a "youth" and I was such as you in my youth. I still listen to Def Lepard, Grand Funk Railroad, and other "loud" bands. My children, and their friends, I can confidently say are also my friends. As for how old I feel, the truth is, you are only as old as the woman you feel! (don't tell SWMBO I said that).

You must also remember that we have a group of moderators, all of whom I respect. Sometimes, we may not agree! We all aim to keep this place a friendly, and congenial place for all to come and feel comfortable. Sometimes we may not all agree, sometimes, we may even take offence at another's comments. As adults, we must all be able to take the good with the bad, and "get over it"


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 14:19

Quote:
Originally posted by LSemmens
You'll find QT, that I have been known to give "more senior" members some grief, too. So I'm not just picking on you.


Oh I know you do. Tomorrow there could be a riot in the 'Late Night Club' and someone - like yourself might close the bar ;) (No alcohol or food) now thats a nasty thought rant0000

Quote:
Nor was I suggesting that you were young


I know it wasn't you who first picked on someones youth. When I joined the forum, there was no warning sign about 'age' or levels of 'comprehention' or passing 'ageist' comments :o(so be wary) :o I just saw this sign welcomey

Quote:
I am observing that you come across as a "youth" and I was such as you in my youth. I still listen to Def Lepard, Grand Funk Railroad, and other "loud" bands. My children, and their friends, I can confidently say are also my friends.


I get that from mixing with Avril fans and 'thats-da-lingo' :P I notice that my dad likes music a bit quieter these days :P "I'm joking actually" ;) He rocks the house man!!!

Quote:
As for how old I feel, the truth is, you are only as old as the woman you feel! (don't tell SWMBO I said that).


I won't!! Thats a secret between You & Moi ;) No other member or mod or admin will dare make a reply to that _karling_reaches

Quote:
You must also remember that we have a group of moderators, all of whom I respect. Sometimes, we may not agree! We all aim to keep this place a friendly, and congenial place for all to come and feel comfortable. Sometimes we may not all agree, sometimes, we may even take offence at another's comments.


Very politically correct...I'd say the same thing if I was a mod :D But I know what you say is also true. I have heard the same thing said on other forums I frequent (not that many BTW) cause...ilovekarls_f & Avril forums (of course) :)

Quote:
As adults, we must all be able to take the good with the bad, and "get over it"


Well 20 years old is still an adult (which I am) even though you can let-it-rip on a forum and be a 60 year old, but act 14 haha!! Or be 15 and try and act 40, etc.. etc.. (no harm...anyroads:P) I have forum friendsof many ages. It doesn't matter to me, as long as there is some humour and some discussion. But things get tooooooo serious sometimes and it can all get spoilt. This pretty much what happened here LSemmens :(

It would be nice if members can get over things, but some can bear grudges, (ain't that the truth huh). Not me like, I always move on - (if people can let that happen) lips_sealed


DeWitch - 8-3-2008 at 14:28

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by DeWitch
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
The majority would agree with me. (Logic and an educated guess) would tell me that the majority would follow suit.


I am so very happy that "the majority" does not rule me.
I live for me and mine and do not give a hoot about what anyone else - and especially what "the majority" thinks.


The majority doesn't rule me either. At no point in this entire thread did I say that - or 'would I say that'. I mearly point out that I (a person) who chooses NOT to worship the Devil, would have a majority vote in my favour. 'That is all I said really'.

Just thought I'd clear that up - just in case somebody or more assumed otherwise and had'nt read the whole thread because of it's <length> :P

you are VERY defensive for someone who uses "the majority" as an example all the time - I have given up reading your page long defensive posts that are so full of quote upon quote- that your mind boggles trying to figure who "is talking now".
Just the same stuff over and over,
looks like you are just trying to beat out some of the other "hot" posts to me.
ummmm....
IMHO;)


DeWitch - 8-3-2008 at 14:31

Quote:
Originally posted by Daz


Yeah, have to agree with that DW.

Nothing will be forced upon my little'un, he's free to choose whatever he wants, and definately no pressure from us regarding religion/devil worshipping et al...

There is of course one caveat...

His choice of football (Soccer if you must!) team..... He will support his local team, and not be a "Plastic"or "Glory Hunter" !!! :D kewl_glasses smokin: :D

ha ha
good for you and yours:)


TooCute4Words - 8-3-2008 at 14:40

Originally posted by TooCute4Words

The majority doesn't rule me either. At no point in this entire thread did I say that - or 'would I say that'. I mearly point out that I (a person) who chooses NOT to worship the Devil, would have a majority vote in my favour. 'That is all I said really'.

Just thought I'd clear that up - just in case somebody or more assumed otherwise and had'nt read the whole thread because of it's <length> :P

Quote:
you are VERY defensive for someone who use "the majority" as an example all the time - I have given up reading your page long defensive posts that are so full of quote upon quote- that your mind boggles trying to figure who "is talking now".
Just the same stuff over and over,
looks like you are just trying to beat out some of the other "hot" posts to me.
ummmm....
IMHO;)


brshteethbrshteethbrshteethand now we are on 'Page No.6' brshteethbrshteethbrshteeth

When...When...When...will some members let it go confused2

I'm past caring now, as it's going around and around in circles. (old ground...and all that)..

I've said what I've said and I have read your posts, so I know your opinion of me.

One point, (worth mentioning). I wouldn't have the cheek to complain how another member writes his or her posts - long or short. With quotes or without quotes. As long as I can read it and understand it (to the best of my ability) then I will be glad to reply in a civil manner.

If there was less knitpicking and less 'references' to age/other negative stuff - we wouldn't be on Page 6. and off-topic, would weconfused2 I am just replying to posts, as I am not ignorant.


Badgergirl - 9-3-2008 at 16:15

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by Badgergirl
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by Badgergirl
You guys are getting me all exited! I can't wait 'till June now!

Maiden are doing their "Somewhere Back in Time" tour and are bound to sing "The Number of the Beast". I'll be there!


Don't get crushed at the front lol ;)

They must be getting on now. They were very successful at their time. Loads of albums and singles and great packaging too.

Quote:
A large amound of their songs mentions Satan in some form, which has got them into trouble in the past. Pity people don't take time out to actually listen to the lyrics and realise they are AGAINST such actions.
Accused of Satanism, they wrote the song "Revalations". You'd have to hear it!


Their album and single covers were pretty horrific shocked_yellow All those picture discs they did. Some are pretty collectable now.

Quote:
TC4W, if you say something is "Fact", it's better to provide some links. We've got some academic sorts here:D

Then again, even with some solid acedemia behind you, we'll still argue the Sun out of the Sky!


"And God said "Let there be light"
And Karlsforums said
"What Colour?"ilovekarls_f


Yeah.....and I've had a bellyful of how things should be done huh :( If that was tried on the majority of the younger population of the Avril forum I also go on, it would be a rather nasty affair - I'll tell you. I'm pretty tolerant and give a fair response. Many on forums don't!!



Again speaking from ignorence, they are STILL the most successful, biggest selling "Heavy Metal" band (Heavy Rock, Rock, Prog Metal...whatever!) on the go!
But I'll forgive you, since you appreciate the Eddie Art!


I never said they were'nt the (most) successful or biggest selling (Heavy Metal) band of all time. I would of thought that Black Sabbath and Led Zeppelin would be pretty close - perhaps even biggerconfused2 but I guess I must be Ignorant huh lips_sealed I also said that they were successful at their time and they must be getting on now. The reason I said that, is because 'single' sales were much better in those days. Anyone trying to make that sort of money today would be struggling some what.

Today, it is bands like Metallica who are taking over. Especially with the younger audience - but even they are old-school now. (doesn't time fly - eh') :P

The Eddie art was magnificent. I guess that was a good selling ploy, appealing to those moshers ;)


Bigger selling than ever before!
Eddie is STILL their logo.
And Punks may dissagree about being "moshers".
*hehe*
Labelling again.....


Redwolf5150 - 9-3-2008 at 16:24

I'm serving notice that I do NOT read those dang multiple quote-filled replies anymore -- from anyone!

If a reply is over a yard long, it's time to make a new reply, not keep hacking the old ones to bits.

kewl_glasses


John_Little - 9-3-2008 at 16:32

I'm with you, Redwolf. We should for a campagne group


SRD - 9-3-2008 at 17:35

I prefer the idea of a champagne group


DeWitch - 9-3-2008 at 21:29

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
I'm serving notice that I do NOT read those dang multiple quote-filled replies anymore -- from anyone!

If a reply is over a yard long, it's time to make a new reply, not keep hacking the old ones to bits.

kewl_glasses

:)


TooCute4Words - 9-3-2008 at 21:48

Quote:
Originally posted by Badgergirl

Bigger selling than ever before!
Eddie is STILL their logo.
And Punks may dissagree about being "moshers".
*hehe*
Labelling again.....


Really?? I never imagined that Iron Maiden would be selling more today than when they were at the height of their career. (actually)...'I'll take that part back' The height of their career must be now :)

I am sure that 'Eddie' will have to STILL be their logo. The fans must demand that too.

Punks, Skins, Rockers, Steps-fans :D (they can all mosh!!) Labelling or otherwise ;)


TooCute4Words - 9-3-2008 at 21:52

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
I'm serving notice that I do NOT read those dang multiple quote-filled replies anymore -- from anyone!

If a reply is over a yard long, it's time to make a new reply, not keep hacking the old ones to bits.

kewl_glasses


It's funny Redwolf, but at one time I never knew how to work out how to do quotes. I just made a massive reply. But then I learnt how to do quotes, which made it easier for moderators to moderate a post (if necessary) and also easier for me to make a VERY good reply and not miss a thing.

Anyway, I'm sure you'd reply if a sexy lady joined the forum and started making very flirtatious lengthy quoted replies :P


Redwolf5150 - 9-3-2008 at 22:53

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
I'm serving notice that I do NOT read those dang multiple quote-filled replies anymore -- from anyone!

If a reply is over a yard long, it's time to make a new reply, not keep hacking the old ones to bits.

kewl_glasses


It's funny Redwolf, but at one time I never knew how to work out how to do quotes. I just made a massive reply. But then I learnt how to do quotes, which made it easier for moderators to moderate a post (if necessary) and also easier for me to make a VERY good reply and not miss a thing.

Anyway, I'm sure you'd reply if a sexy lady joined the forum and started making very flirtatious lengthy quoted replies :P


That was very sexist, and also very untrue.

Besides, Jackie reads the board using my account. You do NOT do things to anger your fianceť when she is originally from Chicago and is of Polish descent.

You'd have better luck pi$$ing off an Italian.

kewl_glasses


TooCute4Words - 9-3-2008 at 23:09

Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words
Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf5150
I'm serving notice that I do NOT read those dang multiple quote-filled replies anymore -- from anyone!

If a reply is over a yard long, it's time to make a new reply, not keep hacking the old ones to bits.

kewl_glasses


It's funny Redwolf, but at one time I never knew how to work out how to do quotes. I just made a massive reply. But then I learnt how to do quotes, which made it easier for moderators to moderate a post (if necessary) and also easier for me to make a VERY good reply and not miss a thing.

Anyway, I'm sure you'd reply if a sexy lady joined the forum and started making very flirtatious lengthy quoted replies :P


That was very sexist, and also very untrue.

Besides, Jackie reads the board using my account. You do NOT do things to anger your fianceť when she is originally from Chicago and is of Polish descent.

You'd have better luck pi$$ing off an Italian.

kewl_glasses


Most women take a glance at a handsome man crossing their path in a shopping mall.

Most men take more than a glance at a stunning babe crossing their path in a shopping mall.

Nothing wrong with that :D


giron - 9-3-2008 at 23:12

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


Most women take a glance at a handsome man crossing their path in a shopping mall.



So do some men, nothing illegal about that, of course.


TooCute4Words - 9-3-2008 at 23:14

Quote:
Originally posted by giron
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


Most women take a glance at a handsome man crossing their path in a shopping mall.



So do some men, nothing illegal about that, of course.


Exactly :D Look but don't touch!!

I like Polish girls ;)


giron - 9-3-2008 at 23:16

Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


I like Polish girls ;)


Is there any particular reason for that preference? confused2


Dreamweaver - 9-3-2008 at 23:19

Quote:
Originally posted by giron
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


I like Polish girls ;)


Is there any particular reason for that preference? confused2


Mr sheen shines umpteen things clean :)


TooCute4Words - 9-3-2008 at 23:20

Quote:
Originally posted by giron
Quote:
Originally posted by TooCute4Words


I like Polish girls ;)


Is there any particular reason for that preference? confused2


No reason, I just have this big list of almost every country in the world and I found Poland on that list :P

This government loves to allow Polish people into this country to stay. I've seen loads recently ;)


giron - 9-3-2008 at 23:24

Say no more, Dot, it was a blatant reference to scrubbers, wasn't it? shocked_yellow

TC4W, you should be ashamed of yourself! waggyfinger


TooCute4Words - 9-3-2008 at 23:27

Quote:
Originally posted by giron


TC4W, you should be ashamed of yourself! waggyfinger


Let the truth be known that one shall speak the truth and not hold back. (my proverb for today)

I shalt not patent it either smokin:


LSemmens - 10-3-2008 at 11:22

Can we, at least keep our minds above our belt buckles.


Nimuae - 26-3-2008 at 15:10

Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Quote:
Originally posted by SRD
As you are unaware of the details I suggest you do some research to get an idea about what satanic worship involves. Lethal human sacrifice is rarely (if at all) a feature in Western satanic worship. You've been reading too much Dennis Wheatley.

From the little I know on the subject; Aleister Crowley(a charlatan)'s injunction that 'Do as thou wilt shall be the whole of the law' ought to be qualified with 'as long as no other objects'.


And Crowley was no Satanist. He was a Thelemite, if one wishes to categorise things... or a member of the OTO or AA or a number of other organisations.

AND - love and do what you will is much, much older than uncle Al... and is pretty much Christian in origin.



Crowley claimed to be the 'beast' even had himself tattooed with 666. He was egoistic and delusional, and exceptionally cruel to his wife.


SRD - 26-3-2008 at 16:01

Quote:
Originally posted by LSemmens
Can we, at least keep our minds above our belt buckles.
Gotta crane?


Redwolf5150 - 26-3-2008 at 16:02

I thought someone put a stake through the heart of this damn thread!

angrymad2


janet - 26-3-2008 at 17:13

Quote:
Originally posted by Nimuae
Quote:
Originally posted by janet
Quote:
Originally posted by SRD
As you are unaware of the details I suggest you do some research to get an idea about what satanic worship involves. Lethal human sacrifice is rarely (if at all) a feature in Western satanic worship. You've been reading too much Dennis Wheatley.

From the little I know on the subject; Aleister Crowley(a charlatan)'s injunction that 'Do as thou wilt shall be the whole of the law' ought to be qualified with 'as long as no other objects'.


And Crowley was no Satanist. He was a Thelemite, if one wishes to categorise things... or a member of the OTO or AA or a number of other organisations.

AND - love and do what you will is much, much older than uncle Al... and is pretty much Christian in origin.



Crowley claimed to be the 'beast' even had himself tattooed with 666. He was egoistic and delusional, and exceptionally cruel to his wife.


He was exceptionally cruel to more than one wife and a great many people. There's no way I'd defend much about the man at all ... but he wasn't a Satanist.