Karl`s PC Help Forums

Domain question
Boypete - 13-2-2008 at 18:50

Hi :)
Within the context of Domain names/registration, and websites, can anyone tell me what the following may mean.
1) "The design, setup, and non-restricted license is estimated to cost ......"

2) "The perpetual domain name would cost......"

?? non restricted and perpetual.
Many thanks :)


dr john - 13-2-2008 at 23:16

It might help if you told us where these phrases arose...
an url so we could read them perhaps?


Boypete - 14-2-2008 at 18:36

The two parts in quotes above, are taken from a newsletter distributed by my local neighbourhood watch. They want to set up a website. They say the 'non restricted license' will cost 750, and the same for a 'perpetual domain name'. They have applied for lottery funding to do this. Now, those phrases mean nothing to me...........Google doesn't help. Methinks, either the Watch are being ripped off, or the watch are on the fiddle. My personal opinion, is the latter.
HTH :)


Quaver - 14-2-2008 at 19:01

Quote:
Originally posted by Boypete
They want to set up a website. They say the 'non restricted license' will cost 750, and the same for a 'perpetual domain name'.

Grrrr! That's expensive. I suppose that's the going rateconfused2


Boypete - 14-2-2008 at 19:34

Quote:
Originally posted by Quaver
Quote:
Originally posted by Boypete
They want to set up a website. They say the 'non restricted license' will cost 750, and the same for a 'perpetual domain name'.

Grrrr! That's expensive. I suppose that's the going rateconfused2


Yes, what what ARE they???


dr john - 14-2-2008 at 20:24

The going rate for a .co.uk domain name in the uk is 6 - 7 for two years.
The going rate for a .com bought via an american registrar is the same.

Your friends are being conned (or are doing the conning)!

There is no such thing as a perpetual domain name, they are only available for one or two years at a time and have to be renewed.

Some of the bigger registrars will take money for a longer period and promise to renew it in time, giving you a discount. and assuming they don't go bust. (I've just renewed one name for three years instead of the normal two, for example, but with a big, reputable registrar).

Next, it is likely that they are also being quoted the cost of a web site design which will be theirs and not used for another client, nor will any fee to continue using the design be required. But that is also perfectly normal, nothing special at all.

If it has any special javascript, however, the designers may be saying they themselves can re-use the script for another client's special effects. Photo-galleries, rollover or show/hide code springs to mind as an example.

You can scan the whole newsletter and email it to me if you like, and I'll give it a reality check. If you'd like that, I can PM you my email address.

For guidance, I charge a minimum of 200 for a five-six page web site, no reduction for less pages (most of the effort goes into the first couple of pages). domain name and hosting is an extra 30 - 45 for two years - depends on what facilities they need, and extra pages are another 30 - 25 each (the more pages, the less it costs per page). But using databases, or shopping carts, or content management systems or other extras can add a bit to the price.

Be careful of any offer to get your site to no. One in google, or submit it to X,000 search engines or directories too.

Finally, don't let someone who has never ordered a web site before be in charge of the project.


Boypete - 14-2-2008 at 20:58

Quote:
Originally posted by dr john
The going rate for a .co.uk domain name in the uk is 6 - 7 for two years.
The going rate for a .com bought via an american registrar is the same.

Your friends are being conned (or are doing the conning)!

There is no such thing as a perpetual domain name, they are only available for one or two years at a time and have to be renewed.

Some of the bigger registrars will take money for a longer period and promise to renew it in time, giving you a discount. and assuming they don't go bust. (I've just renewed one name for three years instead of the normal two, for example, but with a big, reputable registrar).

Next, it is likely that they are also being quoted the cost of a web site design which will be theirs and not used for another client, nor will any fee to continue using the design be required. But that is also perfectly normal, nothing special at all.

If it has any special javascript, however, the designers may be saying they themselves can re-use the script for another client's special effects. Photo-galleries, rollover or show/hide code springs to mind as an example.

You can scan the whole newsletter and email it to me if you like, and I'll give it a reality check. If you'd like that, I can PM you my email address.

For guidance, I charge a minimum of 200 for a five-six page web site, no reduction for less pages (most of the effort goes into the first couple of pages). domain name and hosting is an extra 30 - 45 for two years - depends on what facilities they need, and extra pages are another 30 - 25 each (the more pages, the less it costs per page). But using databases, or shopping carts, or content management systems or other extras can add a bit to the price.

Be careful of any offer to get your site to no. One in google, or submit it to X,000 search engines or directories too.

Finally, don't let someone who has never ordered a web site before be in charge of the project.


Thanks. You've confirmed my thoughts. My domain, hosting and loadsa space costs me 24/year. I've had suspicions for some time that the people running the Watch were on the fiddle. Not sure where I go with it from here though.


Dreamweaver - 14-2-2008 at 21:18

Quote:
Originally posted by Boypete

Thanks. You've confirmed my thoughts. My domain, hosting and loadsa space costs me 24/year. I've had suspicions for some time that the people running the Watch were on the fiddle. Not sure where I go with it from here though.


Couldn't you ask for a breakdown on the costing at the next meeting Pete?
You can voice your opinion without seeming confrontational, keep them sweet but also alert athers to your doubts?


Boypete - 14-2-2008 at 21:47

Hi Dot :)
It's a rather complicated situation. The watch is being run by two related families. Of over 100 houses, only 6 or 7 people go to meetings..........I stopped going some time ago, Their agenda is purely personal, and has little to do with community safety. They have also applied for a grant for a community party.......2000!! It is my beleif that large amounts of money are being mis appropriated. It seems anyone can set up a neighbourhood watch. There are no controls whatever. No accounts need be produced. So, my problem is......who to take my complaint to.


Dreamweaver - 14-2-2008 at 21:54

Quote:
Originally posted by Boypete
Hi Dot :)
It's a rather complicated situation. The watch is being run by two related families. Of over 100 houses, only 6 or 7 people go to meetings..........I stopped going some time ago, Their agenda is purely personal, and has little to do with community safety. They have also applied for a grant for a community party.......2000!! It is my beleif that large amounts of money are being mis appropriated. It seems anyone can set up a neighbourhood watch. There are no controls whatever. No accounts need be produced. So, my problem is......who to take my complaint to.


As most (or indeed all) are run in conjuction with police or local council authoritiesI would suggest one of those.
I can see how it is hard in your position though and hope you can find a solution. Maybe a trip to your local citizens advice bureau?


dr john - 15-2-2008 at 19:14

Without a chance to look at exactly what it said in the newsletter I can't say for sure this is a total con. For example, if they have contacted an web designer and are quoting what he/she said, it could be that the design costs are what you are seeing (or they've gone to an expensive designer, some of whom would charge double or treble what I do)

If it is 750 for a design and build, that could be quite straightforward - they may have asked for things they don't need for example, or for a content management system to avoid goping back and paying every time they want to change something.
But 750 for a domain name sounds like daylight robbery.

As I suggested, scan the newsletter, I'll PM you my email address, and I'll have a look at it from the point of view of someone who knows what he is doing and what is involved.

Also, what is to stop you going to the meeting, with a couple of friends, and telling them there is no such thing as a perpetual domain name and what the cost usually is for a domain name - I can give you some sites to look at to print as proof.

For your own credibility, don't jump in with both feet until it can be shown that the figures are wrong.


LSemmens - 16-2-2008 at 11:12

Wise advice John, I've had no experience at all with web design or domain registration, so I'll stay out of it.


dr john - 17-2-2008 at 23:10

Me again.

I've posted the question re perpetual domain name on a professional forum I frequent, just in case there was something less commonly available that I didn't know about. Most domain names can only be registered for one to two years, although a few variations on TLD can be registered for up to ten years (but NOT UK ones, they are two years at a time). Only one company that anyone knew about (which happens to be in the USA) offers longer time periods than the above and they are basically saying we promise not to go out of business and will pay for your name regularly whenever it comes due for renewal, if you give us a lot of money in advance.

So you should certainly point out this problem with the "perpetual domain name" part of the offer.

Link to what each TLD allows for regisration
http://www.enom.com/domains/faq_tlds.asp

The only places that seem to have anything like a perpetual domain name are governments and international bodies that administer domain names!


SRD - 18-2-2008 at 17:47

I've been doing a bit of research myself for hosting and I've come across free domain for life here:
http://www.hostican.com/hosting/index.php
and here:
http://www.bluehost.com/
and here:
http://www.omdigi.co.uk/WebPacks.aspx
and here:
http://www.anno.com/promotions/domain_for_life.php
in fact googling 'free domain for life' comes up with quite a few hits; some of them are out of date offers but it seems to be the 'in' thing. Of course one will pay for it elsewhere in the package.


Boypete - 20-2-2008 at 19:00

Quote:
Originally posted by dr john
Me again.

I've posted the question re perpetual domain name on a professional forum I frequent, just in case there was something less commonly available that I didn't know about. Most domain names can only be registered for one to two years, although a few variations on TLD can be registered for up to ten years (but NOT UK ones, they are two years at a time). Only one company that anyone knew about (which happens to be in the USA) offers longer time periods than the above and they are basically saying we promise not to go out of business and will pay for your name regularly whenever it comes due for renewal, if you give us a lot of money in advance.

So you should certainly point out this problem with the "perpetual domain name" part of the offer.

Link to what each TLD allows for regisration
http://www.enom.com/domains/faq_tlds.asp

The only places that seem to have anything like a perpetual domain name are governments and international bodies that administer domain names!


Thanks....you have mail :)


Boypete - 20-2-2008 at 19:01

Quote:
Originally posted by SRD
I've been doing a bit of research myself for hosting and I've come across free domain for life here:
http://www.hostican.com/hosting/index.php
and here:
http://www.bluehost.com/
and here:
http://www.omdigi.co.uk/WebPacks.aspx
and here:
http://www.anno.com/promotions/domain_for_life.php
in fact googling 'free domain for life' comes up with quite a few hits; some of them are out of date offers but it seems to be the 'in' thing. Of course one will pay for it elsewhere in the package.

Thanks. Domain may be free, but as you say, paid for elsewhere. But, I imagine it still has to be renewed every 2 years.


dr john - 21-2-2008 at 01:47

Free domain names as in "buy our more expensive than normal hosting service and as long as you pay the bills, we'll pay the domain name, after all we're making much more out of you from the hosting than other places do, and of course life means as long as you are our customer and not one second longer"

The last one in the list above charges $10.95 a month, plus a $12.95 set-up fee (the set-up fee covers the domain name for the first year, of course, so they don't loose if you do a runner after one month)